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    sara's bloodtablets

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    Bloodredhead
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    sara's bloodtablets

    Post by Bloodredhead on Thu Jun 23, 2011 12:24 am

    someone pointed out to me that the shape of the bloodtablets seems to have changed in this chapter, from round to an oval shape. it seems to me sara has altered them probably not just their shape but their formulae too.

    personally i think they are going to bring out the vampire nature more, and make vampires thirst more for real blood. sara was thinking about the tablets in her room with her little sara squad in the new chapter. she seemed to be giving the new tablets to them. maybe trying them out?

    what are everyone else's opinions on the tablets? and what might it lead too?

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    Re: sara's bloodtablets

    Post by Knightmare on Thu Jun 23, 2011 1:33 am

    Its nice that its distinct and now makes it clear whether someone is taking the new or the old ones.

    I reckon she used the hearts of the purebloods that she's been stealing to make them tasty, since purebloods are so tasty. I think she mostly used her own blood to try and control the pill takers through her influence of her blood in them.

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    Re: sara's bloodtablets

    Post by rumland on Thu Jun 23, 2011 1:36 am

    In 73 then talking to ichiju sara says when she saved him she had him drink her blood, but apparently it was not enought so she trys to get him to drink more. Maybe one of her powers is she can have people fall in love with her or ecome devoted to her if they drink enought of her blood. If the new tablets are based on her blood I see a massive army being raised to serve her.
    This will also explain why she is trying to get zero to feed on her.

    sweetsolace
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    Re: sara's bloodtablets

    Post by sweetsolace on Thu Jun 23, 2011 8:21 pm

    Previously this was discussed before, Nina had originally started it and I decided to compile our ideas together as well as others. Very Happy So here's the theory:

    There's something wrong going on with Sara and her pharmaceuticals... She is planning something and it is affecting Yuki.

    **for chapter 73 references since there's none available yet I made one using the raws and nana kramer's translation as found available in this forum, none of it are mine

    First take a look at Yuki's tablets in chapter 72:
    Spoiler:

    She had these tablets on her bedside table since chapter 71
    Spoiler:

    but she didn't take it until chapter 72

    TASTE
    These round tablets tasted unpleasant
    Spoiler:



    the next chapter..

    After this "unpleasant bloodtablets incident" Sara develops a new blood tablet that has a good taste
    Spoiler:
    Note how she tests this tablets to her harem girls...

    *Theory- the round tablets that didn't taste pleasant in 72 were not tested. So Sara realized her mistake, and figured the unpleasant taste would deter her targets from taking it, so she developed a new tablet and made it pleasant.

    To be sure she has it tested on her girls.
    Spoiler:

    how does she do it

    SPIDERS
    *credits to Nina for this original idea~

    As shown here
    Spoiler:
    chapter 67
    Sara can transform into spiders.

    The pharmaceutical president she enslaved before is now her puppet. Notice the spider on his collar and how he's suddenly obedient to her:
    Spoiler:

    In this way she controls people to do what she wants.

    And the spider also roams around as spies

    A spider on Yuki's foot while Takuma and her are in the middle of discussing blood tablets
    Spoiler:

    then in the next moment, before Takuma could tell her more about the new tablets, Sara pops out with ungodly timing
    Spoiler:

    here she deliberately avoids breaching the subject of blood tablets with Yuki, and slaps Takuma, then afterwards tells him something

    Spoiler:
    There, it's clear. Takuma just talked to Yuki about blood tablets and Sara says that he is whispering to people who will be dangerous to her in the future. In short, "Don't fack up and ruin my plans."

    TABLETS AND YUKI
    Here, the debate.
    Yuki's been taking the round gross-tasting tablets since a day ago in chapter 72
    Spoiler:

    and now, ch73
    Spoiler:

    its both the round one, or the old version that was unpleasant tasting, which is different from the new in shape and taste.

    Theory: supposing Sara only changed the taste, the effect of the tablets is still present in the original (in this case, its debatable but probably the round one has it too) Now Yuki took it, but there are no effects visible! Or is it?

    I'll leave this for another discussion of the effects...

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    Re: sara's bloodtablets

    Post by Rose.Petals on Thu Jun 23, 2011 10:03 pm

    Thanks for the breakdown Sweetsolace.

    I think Sara needs to be able to control people because if she was to kill Kaname, then she would have no one else to blame it on. Maybe she wants to control Yuuki to use her to kill lure Kaname into a trap where she can kill him as well. I have a feeling she needs Yuuki and Zero for something.

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    Re: sara's bloodtablets

    Post by juliet on Thu Jun 23, 2011 11:48 pm

    sweetsolace wrote:Previously this was discussed before, Nina had originally started it and I decided to compile our ideas together as well as others. Very Happy So here's the theory:

    There's something wrong going on with Sara and her pharmaceuticals... She is planning something and it is affecting Yuki.

    **for chapter 73 references since there's none available yet I made one using the raws and nana kramer's translation as found available in this forum, none of it are mine

    First take a look at Yuki's tablets in chapter 72:
    Spoiler:

    She had these tablets on her bedside table since chapter 71
    Spoiler:

    but she didn't take it until chapter 72

    TASTE
    These round tablets tasted unpleasant
    Spoiler:



    the next chapter..

    After this "unpleasant bloodtablets incident" Sara develops a new blood tablet that has a good taste
    Spoiler:
    Note how she tests this tablets to her harem girls...

    *Theory- the round tablets that didn't taste pleasant in 72 were not tested. So Sara realized her mistake, and figured the unpleasant taste would deter her targets from taking it, so she developed a new tablet and made it pleasant.

    To be sure she has it tested on her girls.
    Spoiler:

    how does she do it

    SPIDERS
    *credits to Nina for this original idea~

    As shown here
    Spoiler:
    chapter 67
    Sara can transform into spiders.

    The pharmaceutical president she enslaved before is now her puppet. Notice the spider on his collar and how he's suddenly obedient to her:
    Spoiler:

    In this way she controls people to do what she wants.

    And the spider also roams around as spies

    A spider on Yuki's foot while Takuma and her are in the middle of discussing blood tablets
    Spoiler:

    then in the next moment, before Takuma could tell her more about the new tablets, Sara pops out with ungodly timing
    Spoiler:

    here she deliberately avoids breaching the subject of blood tablets with Yuki, and slaps Takuma, then afterwards tells him something

    Spoiler:
    There, it's clear. Takuma just talked to Yuki about blood tablets and Sara says that he is whispering to people who will be dangerous to her in the future. In short, "Don't fack up and ruin my plans."

    TABLETS AND YUKI
    Here, the debate.
    Yuki's been taking the round gross-tasting tablets since a day ago in chapter 72
    Spoiler:

    and now, ch73
    Spoiler:

    its both the round one, or the old version that was unpleasant tasting, which is different from the new in shape and taste.

    Theory: supposing Sara only changed the taste, the effect of the tablets is still present in the original (in this case, its debatable but probably the round one has it too) Now Yuki took it, but there are no effects visible! Or is it?

    I'll leave this for another discussion of the effects...

    Wonderful sum up of the action... cheers cheers cheers cheers thank you for providing this, also let's not forget that Sara is trying to meddle with the tablets many chapters before and if she did and made one of testing how should we know? something like that should be kept as a secret, plus as Nina pointed out the prisoners at the cellar? what other use would they have?

    Now where did she get that tasty blood?






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    Re: sara's bloodtablets

    Post by nina on Thu Jun 23, 2011 11:50 pm

    Thank you sweetsolace for the great post you've made, providing scans as well! cheers sLo_BigBearHug


    I’ll put into spoiler my theory about the spoiled tablets cuz I’ve already posted in another thread and you might already have read it.

    But here is the most appropriate thread, so …

    Spoiler:


    Now … I was one from the many Yumes who has expected a bite from Yuuki … in fact I said that I prefer to be Yuuki the one who’ll bite Zero and not vice versa. So no surprise from the development lol.

    On the other hand we have to be blind to not realising that something is wrong with Yuuki’s hunger. We saw how her hunger was increasing gradually from chapter to chapter but in the current chapter her thirst is abnormal!
    She took just a few hours before 3-4 tabs, maybe more, but her thirst instead of be tamed, even just a little bit, is increased … she is so hungry, almost like a level-e vampire (I’m exaggerating just to make a point). Even if the tablets aren’t so effective like the real blood, or tasteful, that doesn’t mean that they’re totally ineffective, right? It contradicts any logic … how all the NC lived for a whole year, only with tabs; and Yuuki can’t hold her self for a few days?

    The scene with Yori just proves, what I’m saying … she freaked out from her own thoughts! She was so abnormally hungry that she was agitated from Yori’s delicious blood! So we have another info/confirmation here … the blood of a beloved person (despite the type of love) is the most wanted … especially if the vampire is feeling hungry.
    Yuuki isn’t the first time that she meets/hugs Yori … and I suppose Yori’s blood didn’t change in a few months?! Hahaha! But is the first time that Yuuki is so thirsty to notice how delicious it is …

    So … what made Yuuki so abnormally thirsty to the point that even Zero noticed and offered his blood, in order to protect the D/NC?

    My theory is the tampered tablets … I stated my theory days before the release of the chapter 73 and now I believe stronger in it.

    What I had said …

    I think the possibility to see a bite from Yuuki to Zero is highly. But what it counts are the circumstances under which will take place the incident and not necessarily the act itself! For reasons that I don’t want to expose here and now I prefer a bite from Yuuki to Zero and not vise versa … and my reasoning has nothing to do with the resolution of the LT.

    1. A possible way to have the “infamous” bite could be the spoiled tablets for example. If Sara has done something with them (as many of us suspected), then since Yuuki is a target for her, she might try to alter the bottle with tabs that Yuuki has on her night table. The build up is there already from Hino … the tablets are an issue updated and upgraded in the last chapters. Yuuki’s thirst is increasing … Sara’s lies about Kaname served that purpose, her door is unlocked (or as she said to Zero it was stupid of her not to notice that the door was open …) and Yuuki doesn’t hide her blood-thirst (Maria, Zero knows about it already). So the stage is very convenient for Sara, she has the motive, the means and probably the opportunity … If that happens then Yuuki might bite Zero without none of them knowing what drove her there … you can suspect the implications if that happens … Yuuki’s guilt, Zero’s (?) etc, etc. New ambiguity, tense and cliffhanger …


    So my prediction was pretty much “accurate” … now remains to see if also the reason behind that bite is accurate too lol. And think about it … even if Hino is going to pull that trick with the tabs, do you think that she would let us know? Of course not … it doesn’t serve the climax that way … So she would keep it as a secret from us, as a big revelation for later on. >0<

    I’ll try to trail the hints which might be the innuendos that Yuuki has indeed taken the altered Sara’s tablets.

    1. Yuuki’s uncontrollable thirst.

    2. Yuuki’s “strange” comments in the previous chapter about the taste and the synthesis of the tabs!!! She sensed the presence of countless people … she was wondering from whose cells were made of, only to conclude how unpleasant were.
    Now I think there is the key … Hino didn’t put Yuuki to think so analytically about the synthesis of the tabs for nothing. Their taste is well-known that is unpleasant, so why such an emphasis there; … just to tell us how spoiled Yuuki is; how tasteless/unpleasant are; or that she never took before tabs? We already knew all that lol.
    My point is that the tablets which Yuuki took were made from Sara’s prisoners … from the miserable slaves she has kept in the dungeon in her house! So their torture and agonized feelings were infused in the tablets, hence and Yuuki’s disgust … Yuuki has like a “sixth sense” … so she’s more sensitive from others. Plus another significant thing … Yuuki had never tasted before the blood tablets, so she can’t compared them … that’s why I believe she was the only one that Sara gave, her altered tabs, thus and Yuuki’s abnormally increased blood-lust.

    Now in this chapter we only see how Sara is testing the tabs in order to make them more tasteful ... but we don’t know if she already had made ones?! So Yuuki could be her first “victim” /”guinea pig”.
    After all she is a great candidate cuz of her lack of experience with tablets and of course is one of her main targets … she would be delightful if Yuuki’s NC will proved just a farce, and synchronously make Yuuki to seem like she is incapable to be the “leader” of the vampires! Do you think that all that talk between Yuuki and Zero about her NC and how she must get a hold of herself is irrelevant??? No… if Yuuki’s attempt collapses, then Sara will be the next Queen … (remember Cross words … someone will step in and will take the position of the head in the vampire society!).

    So after Yuuki’s reaction … now she’s trying to make them more pleasant because she’s planning to spread these tablets and create a chaos! The better taste from the common tabs is the catch … Now I don’t know if she’s planning to spread her tablets to all vampire society (most likely) or only to the NC … will see.

    Takuma’s ignorance doesn’t prove anything … most likely doesn’t know that Sara already made a batch of tabs … it’s not the first time that he’ll be informed afterwards … he only knows that she’s scheming something. Also another emphatic hint … Sara’s spiders are everywhere … so she could easily “heard” Yuuki’s-Maria’s previous conversation about the tabs, thus and she knew about the disgusting taste and decided to make new ones<< that’s her next step … since as it seems she accomplished her first mission >> Yuuki’s cancellation by making her to seem like “crazy level-e” vampire, thinking only blood, incapable to lead the NC and further more, vampires’ society …


    Now what I want to make clearer …

    If Yuuki’s weird thirst is originated from Sara’s tampered tablets that doesn’t mean that she gave to Yuuki the new oval ones (chap.73) … obviously she didn’t. If Yuuki was consuming the oval tablets then I wouldn’t talk about a theory but about a fact!

    Think about it … how stupid would be from her to give Yuuki tampered tablets with different shape and pleasant taste hahaha … Do you think that even the ignorant Yuuki, wouldn’t notice such differences??

    The core of the theory is that Sara had already altered tablets and passed them ONLY to Yuuki! Not to Zero, nor to anybody else thus far. That’s why there is no evidence or abnormal thirst to any other vampire. And is logical … cuz if her spoiled tablets have more disgusting taste (viz different) than the common tabs, wouldn’t any regular user notice the difference? That’s why Yuuki was the best candidate, cuz she can’t compared the regular ones with the spoiled ones.

    So … now she is changing also the taste, in order to make them more tasteful because she is planning to spread them as a new product better and more pleasant than the previous one! << This is the next step for her plans … to create a chaos …

    Yuuki maybe was just her first “victim”, but she (/we) doesn’t know yet…






    "... I want to fall down with you to the very farthest depths ... taint me too Kaname"



    Spoiler:

    *wants to sneak under these bed sheets*

    mariangie
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    Re: sara's bloodtablets

    Post by mariangie on Fri Jun 24, 2011 8:34 am

    A possibility :

    The new good - tasting blood tablets could be made using the latest kiddnapped kids flesh and blood . As the babies / infant / small humans are the third most tasty blood for vampires . ( 1st pureblood , 2nd the blood of a loved one . )

    I believed first Sara's blood could the source for the new tasty formula . But there's something fishy about not telling yet the source of the new pills . Also she can't be making anything that could empower other vampires . So I was probably wrong here .

    If this is true . Sara is the main responsible for the latest kids kiddnapping .

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    Re: sara's bloodtablets

    Post by Knightmare on Fri Jun 24, 2011 8:51 am

    sweetsolace wrote:
    **for chapter 73 references since there's none available yet I made one using the raws and nana kramer's translation as found available in this forum, none of it are mine

    TASTE
    These round tablets tasted unpleasant
    Spoiler:



    the next chapter..

    After this "unpleasant bloodtablets incident" Sara develops a new blood tablet that has a good taste
    Spoiler:
    Note how she tests this tablets to her harem girls...

    *Theory- the round tablets that didn't taste pleasant in 72 were not tested. So Sara realized her mistake, and figured the unpleasant taste would deter her targets from taking it, so she developed a new tablet and made it pleasant.
    Kudos for compiling this, just a couple of comments.
    - The tablets have always tasted bad, hence Maria's agreement and everyone else's negativity about eating them since day one.
    - Sara could not have adjusted the tablets after Yuuki's first taste, because this scene in chapter 72 only takes place the night before chapter 73.
    - If Sara were already developing tasty tablets prior to Yuuki's first taste, why give her the bad tasting ones? And why do the tablets change shape? Sara is clearly making them distinct.

    @Nina - Yes, the theory makes a little more sense if there are two tablets versions, the oval one that Sara is making tasty and openly marketing, the other is a "poisonous" version disguising itself as the popular tablet that vampires use, as Yuuki's is stamped with the standard id. 6E... that Sara has secretely sent to her.

    I don't really agree with the theory, it opens a can of worms, what is Sara's motivation, what does she gain when she's already shaking up things with Kaname and Zero is the one she has stated that she wants. And there's no indication Yuuki's tablets have been swapped.

    There are other reasons though that the normal tablets are not sating Yuuki's thirst, perhaps because she's too used to cuisine of pureblood. Her emotional conflicts could be another reason, similar to how following their parents death, Kaname was eating handfuls of the tablets too. Perhaps a combination of factors. There are too many special circumstances that we can really apply a rule and say "that's abnormal", we have too few examples to begin with.

    Sara's new tablets - I still think they are made from purebloods. Smile the tastiest thing around to everyone.

    libra
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    Re: sara's bloodtablets

    Post by libra on Fri Jun 24, 2011 10:28 am

    Knightmare wrote:
    Sara's new tablets - I still think they are made from purebloods. Smile the tastiest thing around to everyone.

    I've read a few times these couple of days that a pureblood's blood is tasty, delicious and things like that, but I am not sure that this is totally true.

    When Zero drunk from Kaname said that his blood tastes like poison.

    Spoiler:


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    Re: sara's bloodtablets

    Post by juliet on Fri Jun 24, 2011 10:58 am

    mariangie wrote:A possibility :

    The new good - tasting blood tablets could be made using the latest kiddnapped kids flesh and blood . As the babies / infant / small humans are the third most tasty blood for vampires . ( 1st pureblood , 2nd the blood of a loved one . )

    I believed first Sara's blood could the source for the new tasty formula . But there's something fishy about not telling yet the source of the new pills . Also she can't be making anything that could empower other vampires . So I was probably wrong here .

    If this is true . Sara is the main responsible for the latest kids kiddnapping .

    I have the same idea with you, plus the exaggerated episodes with the kidnappings (not killings) of children;

    Spoiler:




    We see that they are not blind attacks, they are organised:
    Spoiler:


    Two more children are missing…

    Spoiler:

    Where are they? Still no answer

    Spoiler:

    The vampire above that has taken the children that are missing, is the vampire that he had kidnapped the child that was later transfered to the association..

    Notice the woman figure/silhouette wrapped with a cloak that stands on top of that building at the time of the attack..
    Spoiler:

    There are three points that I find strange

    1. The vampire seems to have charmed the baby/ hypnotized it in a way himself since he did not have the time to deliver it to another master/ the hunters retrieved it...

    Spoiler:

    Spoiler:

    2. Zero loses the vampire by seeing blood
    Spoiler:

    3. the vampire recognizes Yuuki..from somewhere

    Spoiler:

    Regardless of the above, a theory might be that the kidnapped children would have been given to Sara to collect their blood. We see that the cover of the tablets is that they will taste good in order to lure vampires into taking more...

    But apparently this can not be just it, other substances must have been used in order to make the vampires more weak or enslaved to Sara, Sara's blood could be used to change their substance...the effects and what must be used to alter their quality should be seen separately.
    As a taste to the first altered tablets the blood of the prisoners could have been used (even though the emotional condition if these people could have made it even worst as Nina said), and their cells would also constitute the main part of the pills...so what the children's blood would hide would be the taste...and that would be perhaps the last stage of perfecting the tablets...until then they tasted awful just as before.

    So the one thing (that she now perfected them in taste) does not need necessarily cancel the theory that prior experiments needed to have been made to the tablets that would first essentially change their quality/substance/effects (that's the core), after this the last step would be to convey the bad taste...

    There are many things I believe hidden and no one clearly has not open his cards yet...another hidden notion
    Spoiler:

    So even the hunters may know more than the say...


    Last edited by juliet on Fri Jun 24, 2011 11:22 am; edited 1 time in total






    I' ll show you a sweet dream next time

    libra
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    Re: sara's bloodtablets

    Post by libra on Fri Jun 24, 2011 11:12 am

    juliet I think your theory is the most reasonable explanation with all the facts that Hino gave up till now.

    I think though that the vampire recognized Yuki from the smell of her blood. That she is a pureblood. We've seen how vampires are recognizing the smell of the purebloods at once! That's all!


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    Re: sara's bloodtablets

    Post by juliet on Fri Jun 24, 2011 11:29 am

    libra wrote:juliet I think your theory is the most reasonable explanation with all the facts that Hino gave up till now.

    I think though that the vampire recognized Yuki from the smell of her blood. That she is a pureblood. We've seen how vampires are recognizing the smell of the purebloods at once! That's all!


    Thank you Lib...about the vampire his suprisement though is too big; YOU..in a place like that, like he knows her from somewhere, trying to remember where else he might have been, he seems a pawn someone that is used as a slave to a higher master..we will see...the fact is that he must be interrogated from the hunters since Yuuki's wondering bag got him affraid ...

    But the plot with the tablets, I think that it goes quite back...other wise just for a different flavor, what would be all these about? I think that she has been experimenting with them..long time now. Now she just makes it perfect to convey the bad taste so that the vampires would he happy to consume more and more. I think that Sara's plan is to make them all slaves, we've seen that she used her blood to enlave her harem, the president of the pharmaceutical company, Takuma, but the tablets target to the rest of the vampires..so it could be possible and a very complete scheme.

    The thing is that she has not gone unoticed the hunters did notice it...






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    Re: sara's bloodtablets

    Post by libra on Fri Jun 24, 2011 11:40 am

    About the vampire I thought it was something like You, a pureblood, in a place like that! None, Kaname or Sara or anyother purebloods would go in a pub searching for a vampire, right?

    You are right though about the hunters. It looks like they know a lot. Zero was questioning Sara's actions in quite a lot chapters back.

    sweetsolace
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    Re: sara's bloodtablets

    Post by sweetsolace on Fri Jun 24, 2011 1:14 pm

    Knighmare wrote:
    - The tablets have always tasted bad, hence Maria's agreement and everyone else's negativity about eating them since day one.
    - Sara could not have adjusted the tablets after Yuuki's first taste, because this scene in chapter 72 only takes place the night before chapter 73.
    - If Sara were already developing tasty tablets prior to Yuuki's first taste, why give her the bad tasting ones? And why do the tablets change shape? Sara is clearly making them distinct.

    juliet wrote:
    So the one thing (that she now perfected them in taste) does not
    need necessarily that it cancels the theory that prior experiments have
    been made to the tablets that would first essentially change their
    quality/substance/effects (that's the core), after this the last step
    would be to convey the bad taste...

    Yes agree with juliet it doesnt have to be cancelled after all its sara were talking about.

    its a fact that BTs taste bad...but the fanbook said it was actually tasteless, so I dont know which is true. Im sure Aido said somewhere that BTs are an ongoing research experiment and efforts have been made to improving it including the taste, there are also various types of BT and the variety can also mean different tastes.
    Like Nina said, this doesn't mean that the BT was not replaced by another. ch71 the tablet case was already at her bedside, Sara knew Kaname was gone and Yuki had no replenishment, she can easily use this to her advantage by tampering with her supply of BT and it is most conveniently placed where its found in Yuki's bedroom.
    As for the short time frame I dont know how that can be justified but Sara is pushing her minions to work hard and she doesnt need to mass produce tablets, she only has to create a few and replace Yuki's BT with it, as she's the only target. hence its possible to be created at a short time. As for the distinct shape, I think its for marketing purposes to make her tablets sell in contrast to the ones that taste bad, the round BT Yuki has (if it was tampered) was not altered to prevent suspicion .

    I think Sara can have plans that concerns both BT tampering and Yuki because of:
    -Sara especially told Takuma after that he was whispering to the ears of
    the people who would be dangerous to her in the future. It sounds like a
    plan was already made
    -she doesnt want Yuki to hear about the new good tasting BT she made. why not? it is pleasant right? and it is a good tasting BT, different from the one Yuki disliked. why was it dangerous to tell her, other than the fact that yuki might notice something was wrong and doubt the BT? Sara didn't want Yuki to doubt her BT, and that's either because Yuki is already taking the tampered ones, or Sara plans to advertise the BT to her in the future, or she doesnt want to shatter Yuki's illusion that Sara is a villain in sheep clothing. Many reasons.
    -If Sara did swap Yuki's BT with her homemade ones like Nina pointed, theres a chance Takuma doesnt know about it, Sara has lots of tools at hand and she can use these.
    -Yuki is acting strange with her hunger bouts. Especially towards Yori. She just took a few BT a day ago (I know its a day ago because Maria says sara confronted zero "yesterday") and now she took one again, but she is still hungry which Zero noted to be present on her eyes. And the lust might have made her "crazy" since Yuki suggested that she wants to talk to him like before.
    *But just to remind we can see Yuki was still sane and conscious when she met Zero as you can see her thoughts play around angst and Zero himself, so Im not saying her biting him was under the influence of the BT, if she was taking the tampered ones.

    //
    juliet wrote:
    As a taste to the first altered tablets the blood of the prisoners
    could have been used (even though the emotional condition if these
    people could have made it even worst as Nina said)...what the children's
    blood could hide would be the taste...and that would be perhaps the
    last stage of perfecting the tablets...until then they tasted awful just
    as before.
    Yes I think this is quite possible as what other purpose could Sara's
    prisoners have. Well there's one, manipulation : she imprisoned the CEO
    pharmacy president and then later used him as a puppet... i dont think
    she is using the others as puppet as there's too many of them, so what
    other purpose... her main project is BT tampering, so perhaps... the BT
    was made out of redbloodcells (in humans) so it must have a human source.

    *theory - Sara made an initial batch of BTs just intended to be used by Yuki, she needed immediate source for blood so she used the prisoners. Hence the bad taste. And Yuki's flashback seeing the countless faces in it.
    The tablets in her new production tasted good because she used her blood and the blood of young children she arranged to be kidnapped by vampires she control, to make it taste good

    //
    knightmare wrote:
    Sara's new tablets - I still think they are made from purebloods. Smile the tastiest thing around to everyone.
    there are too few purebloods available, nor are they willing to offer her blood I doubt. And the only one most conveniently available to her is herself which brings

    juliet wrote:
    But apparently this can not be just it, other substances must have
    been used in order to make the vampires more weak or enslaved to Sara,
    Sara's blood could be used to change their substance...the effects and
    what must be used to alter their quality should be seen separately.

    Yes, she is probably giving a drop of her blood in the mixture. Ofc, Sara can't be just creating BTs that are beneficial for vampires, she has plans with it, and her blood can have an effect to the vampires that take it.... (Perhaps to make them obey her?)
    As for the taste I think its her blood that gives the tablets a pleasant taste, or its the kidnapped human children's young blood that makes it pleasant, or it can be a little of both, or just one.

    As said here:
    mariangie wrote:
    The new good - tasting blood tablets could be made using the
    latest kiddnapped kids flesh and blood . As the babies / infant / small
    humans are the third most tasty blood for vampires . ( 1st pureblood ,
    2nd the blood of a loved one . )

    I believed first Sara's blood
    could the source for the new tasty formula . But there's something fishy
    about not telling yet the source of the new pills . Also she can't be
    making anything that could empower other vampires . So I was probably
    wrong here .

    If this is true . Sara is the main responsible for the latest kids kiddnapping .

    //

    juliet wrote:
    1. The vampire seems to have charmed the baby/ hypnotized it in a
    way himself since he did not have the time to deliver it to another
    master/ the hunters retrieved it...

    http://i27.mangareader.net/vampire-knight/69/vampire-knight-2052705.jpg

    The vampire above that has taken the children that are missing, is
    the vampire that he had kidnapped the child that was later transfered to
    the association..

    great deduction there juliet! Yes it said the way vampires kidnapped children is: there is one who takes the child and there is one who receives it. So this fits perfectly to that description! cheers

    So the kidnapper vampire charms the child, leaves her on the area, and escapes. Zero and Kaito gives chase... Kaito sees the child and brings her to the association while Zero went after the vampire. Then

    Zero loses the vampire by seeing blood

    hence the weird reason why Zero couldnt capture the target vampire in chapter 69 and 70. But whose blood? It was not the little girl's as she was taken by Kaito before Zero gave chase. Whoever blood that belongs to, it stopped Zero from his pursuit. Or whatever stopped him.

    //
    juliet wrote:
    .about the vampire his suprisement though is too big; YOU..in a place
    like that, like he knows her from somewhere, trying to remember where
    else he might have been, he seems a pawn someone that is used as a slave
    to a higher master..we will see...the fact is that he must be
    interrogated from the hunters since Yuuki's wondering bag got him affraid ...

    libra wrote:
    About the vampire I thought it was something like You, a pureblood, in a
    place like that! None, Kaname or Sara or anyother purebloods would go
    in a pub searching for a vampire, right?

    yes I agree with libra somewhat it appears to be that way... at first I also thought it can only be that the vampire recognized Yuki from somewhere, but it can also be that she is a pureblood and her presence in a vampire pub was unusual. meh, this is im leaning to for now~

    juliet wrote:
    But the plot with the tablets, I think that it goes quite
    back...other wise just for a different flavor, what would be all these
    about? I think that she has been experimenting with them..long time now.
    Now she just makes it perfect to convey the bad taste so that the
    vampires would he happy to consume more and more. I think that Sara's
    plan is to make them all slaves, we've seen that she used her blood to
    enlave her harem, the president of the pharmaceutical company, Takuma,
    but the tablets target to the rest of the vampires..so it could be
    possible and a very complete scheme.

    I agree with you juliet it seems to be connected as it was described closely together. one chapter yuki taste unpleasant tablets, then the next chap sara is making a new batch of pleasant ones, and she is also wary of letting yuki know... odd right?
    yes i think its what she's planning, to build her army discreetly so she can face kaname with enough minions to defeat him. or she can be building an army...

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    Re: sara's bloodtablets

    Post by Knightmare on Fri Jun 24, 2011 1:17 pm

    libra wrote:
    Knightmare wrote:
    Sara's new tablets - I still think they are made from purebloods. Smile the tastiest thing around to everyone.

    I've read a few times these couple of days that a pureblood's blood is tasty, delicious and things like that, but I am not sure that this is totally true.

    When Zero drunk from Kaname said that his blood tastes like poison.
    Well Zero is the exception to a lot of rules and neither is he unbias towards Kaname himself and if you receive (a little of) the persons feelings, drinking the blood of someone who mutually hates you and who loves the person you love, it can't be pleasant.

    I just go by Kaname statement about it being the most desirable.
    http://www.mangareader.net/104-33723-11/vampire-knight/chapter-54.html
    To be fair, the reason it is most desirable is because of the powers and properties their blood holds. The taste factor may be debatable, but the desire to drink it, is the strongest I think.

    http://www.mangareader.net/104-2101-18/vampire-knight/chapter-10.html
    Unlike human children, pureblood is absolutely taboo and generally the fear and respect overrides everything. Also, Aidou saying that it is the taboo act against purebloods, makes me wonder if this is what his father was accusing Kaname of when he said he participated in the worst crime against purebloods? Maybe Kaname was doing his own experimentation with the blood tablets? Because Sara was taking their hearts, this is what made me think she might be using it for her experiments, she takes over the company and the next chapter she's out stealing hearts.

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    Re: sara's bloodtablets

    Post by sweetsolace on Fri Jun 24, 2011 1:24 pm

    one other thing... If Sara is clever and she is aiming for Kaname, the best and easiest way is to control Yuki. Yuki is closest to Kaname's heart and she is his weakness, if there's any easier way to bring kaname down its to exploit his weakness and that is Yuki. It would be a bit stupid of her not to notice this Very Happy and not do something about it. Sara is in the academy for a reason and I don't think its to have a tea party with her harem.

    She wants something there. Very Happy Ofc I'd go for the obvious - yuki

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    Re: sara's bloodtablets

    Post by libra on Fri Jun 24, 2011 1:40 pm

    Knightmare wrote:

    I just go by Kaname statement about it being the most desirable.
    http://www.mangareader.net/104-33723-11/vampire-knight/chapter-54.html
    To be fair, the reason it is most desirable is because of the powers and properties their blood holds. The taste factor may be debatable, but the desire to drink it, is the strongest I think.

    @knightmare I think we both agree that tasty and desired is too different meenings, so PB's blood might be desirable full of powers and a taboo but that doesn't make it tasty.

    During the whole manga I had always the feeling that the taste of blod had only to do with the feelings.

    @sweetsolace I think that Yuki's blood would be better even from Kaname's blood. That's why Rido was after Yuki and not after Kaname. Because of the reach blood of the young princess. Probably that's why Rido used baby-Kaname to wake up ancestor-Kaname in the first place.

    So Sara might be after Yuki, but she needs a good chance to take her down without compromising her plans.

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    Re: sara's bloodtablets

    Post by juliet on Fri Jun 24, 2011 1:57 pm

    @ Just a quick notice...

    Solace I am going to see the fanbook and tell you about the tablets being tasteless (I do not remember that now of memory).

    About the time that you mentioned and Knightmare also did; that Sara has not enough time to change the flavor;

    of course she has because if it is organized and intented then the first patch she creates is to test their effects, their core elements, she won't add the flavor unless she is sure that they are bringing her the final result eitherwise she would have to go steps back subtracting and adding elements from the beggining...

    so to save time; she creates the first tablets from the blood of the prisoners that provide the major part of the cells (thus the unpleasant feeling) that Nina mentioned...there she can add the substance that will make the difference and charm/weaken vampires, the way she wants it...

    she tests them, its okay...she knows their flavor is bad (perhaps even worst from the original)...so she releases the next batch where the flavor is tasty...

    Yuuki has taken the prior patch, they are not good, she notices it, they are not just bad in taste, they create her and transfer her an incoherent picture...

    but this is something that Sara has intended to fix and now she already has the next pact available...

    Also a reason not to use the blood of the children in the first time would be that they are difficult to get, a rare ingredient so she would put it at the final product to ensure maximum consuption


    Also, Aidou saying that it is the taboo act against purebloods, makes me wonder if this is what his father was accusing Kaname of when he said he participated in the worst crime against purebloods? Maybe Kaname was doing his own experimentation with the blood tablets? Because Sara was taking their hearts, this is what made me think she might be using it for her experiments, she takes over the company and the next chapter she's out stealing hearts.

    The worst crime...Kaname is commiting it again, its the killing of purebloods you are right. The experiments were made by the nightclass, I guess that the tablets should contain human blood, back in the past the council was taking offerings from humans...

    I thought about pureblood's blood used but as Solace mentioned, Sara would not want the too powerful, I guess she would like a special ability example; weakening the enemy, charming the enemy used at the tablets..not something in general that would empower them.

    But just to remind we can see Yuki was still sane and conscious when she met Zero as you can see her thoughts play around angst and Zero himself, so Im not saying her biting him was under the influence of the BT, if she was taking the tampered ones.

    If she has taken tampered tablets, that could be easily put in her room, since Sara is in the academy, then the first symptom that we are seeing is intense hunger that the tablets can not satisfy. That could eventually end in agression (like the incidents that we had seen in the city).

    hence the weird reason why Zero couldnt capture the target vampire in chapter 69 and 70. But whose blood? It was not the little girl's as she was taken by Kaito before Zero gave chase. Whoever blood that belongs to, it stopped Zero from his pursuit. Or whatever stopped him.

    The vampire's blood I guess? there is a fight there. And the vampire had hypnotized that girl so his blood has charming abilities? I do not know, I am sure though that Zero there reacts strangely, he has been through harder conditions for that to happen to him out of the blue due to hunger. Its like his hunger is also not that well sustained but he has the level e/d allibi.

    Well that's all in theory of course, but if Hino does not make it epic we will for sure hahahha rofl rofl rofl rofl








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    Re: sara's bloodtablets

    Post by nina on Fri Jun 24, 2011 1:59 pm

    knightmare wrote:
    - The tablets have always tasted bad, hence Maria's agreement and everyone else's negativity about eating them since day one.

    True the tablets weren’t the vampires’ cup of tea and of course it can’t be compared with the fresh blood. But still Hino’s emphasis on the disgusting/unpleasant taste and on the synthesis (countless people’s presence), do you think is random, with none special meaning behind? If so what purpose serves; to let us know how tasteless are, or how Yuuki is feeling unpleasant taking them? We already knew all about these … so why Yuuki’s analytical thoughts about the cells are made off etc?


    - Sara could not have adjusted the tablets after Yuuki's first taste, because this scene in chapter 72 only takes place the night before chapter 73.

    You could be right on that … but Sara could have started the production of the new “breed” long before. Still doesn’t create any hole on the theory about the tampered tablets. But do you remember what the president of the pharmaceutical company said to Takuma when he found him in the dungeon; that Sara is planning to do something horrible. So the president already knew about her schemes. Since then, enough time has passed, so Sara had plenty of time to create a first batch of altered tabs using the blood of her prisoners.


    - If Sara were already developing tasty tablets prior to Yuuki's first taste, why give her the bad tasting ones? And why do the tablets change shape? Sara is clearly making them distinct.

    Isn’t obvious why??? It would be more logical for Sara to give Yuuki tampered tablets with pleasant taste and especially with different shape??? The alteration wouldn’t be easily noticeable even from the ignorant Yuuki?
    How logical is that? IF Sara has passed to Yuuki her spoiled tablets, isn’t obvious that she would like to remain a secret; firstly from Yuuki, further more from the others. For example … even if Yuuki didn’t notice the difference, Maria who saw Yuuki taking the tabs wouldn’t observe the difference on the shape?
    Sara doesn’t want to be found out her plans, in this stage.

    I don't really agree with the theory, it opens a can of worms, what is Sara's motivation, what does she gain when she's already shaking up things with Kaname and Zero is the one she has stated that she wants. And there's no indication Yuuki's tablets have been swapped.

    She didn’t declare openly that she wants to be the Queen … As I said before …

    Spoiler:
    After all she is a great candidate cuz of her lack of experience with tablets and of course is one of her main targets … she (Sara) would be delightful if Yuuki’s NC will proved just a farce, and synchronously make Yuuki to seem like she is incapable to be the “leader” of the vampires! Do you think that all that talk between Yuuki and Zero about her NC and how she must get a hold of herself is irrelevant??? No… if Yuuki’s attempt collapses, then Sara will be the next Queen … (remember Cross words … someone will step in and will take the position of the head in the vampire society!).

    … so seems like Yuuki was the first who had to go … think about it … she wants to take Yuuki out of her way >> making Yuuki to seem unfit for the role of the head in vampire’s society >> the road is open for her to claim the throne. Of course she doesn’t want to unveil that she is behind Yuuki’s failure … would she? She doesn’t want to leave traces/evidence that she is the one who move the strings … cuz if she be found now, how she’s gonna spread the tabs to the vampires? She plays the good girl to the hunters and to Yuuki … she throws all the blame to Kaname, even for her crimes … isn’t transparent that she is working under cover and on multiple layers?

    The new batch of tablets, more tasteful and pleasant, is the catch, in order to lure the vampires to prefer her tablets over the old ones, hence and the different shape for been more detectable. As a marketing plan to sale better her product.

    There are other reasons though that the normal tablets are not sating Yuuki's thirst, perhaps because she's too used to cuisine of pureblood. Her emotional conflicts could be another reason, similar to how following their parents death, Kaname was eating handfuls of the tablets too. Perhaps a combination of factors. There are too many special circumstances that we can really apply a rule and say "that's abnormal", we have too few examples to begin with.


    The problem here is not the satisfaction but the “tameness” … true there are many factors that have increased Yuuki’s thirst (I have mentioned them many times and I’m not dismissing them). But the problem here is that Yuuki’s thirst isn’t tamed neither just a little bit, on the contrary seems like increasing. The example you brought about Kaname also giving us the info that the tabs have a certain result … he took the tabs in order not to harm the “offer”. Again … if the tablets haven’t any affect over the blood-lust then how and why the NC or Zero using them? It doesn’t make any sense not to work only to Yuuki’s case … the “spoiled part” goes to the satisfaction, not to tameness.

    *********************

    Juliet wrote: The vampire above that has taken the children that are missing, is the vampire that he had kidnapped the child that was later transfered to the association..

    Notice the woman figure/silhouette wrapped with a cloak that stands on top of that building at the time of the attack..


    There are three points that I find strange

    1. The vampire seems to have charmed the baby/ hypnotized it in a way himself since he did not have the time to deliver it to another master/ the hunters retrieved it...

    You are on the spot Juliet. Excellent presentation!
    We have discussed the female-figure when the chapter was released.

    The strange thing here is the “hypnotized” child. Such an interference as to remove emotions is an indication for a PBs involvement … I mean the vampire who kidnapped the child could have such a power? I don’t think that even a noble vampire can have such an influence/power.

    Furthermore the last incident with the “still doll” child happened after Sara took Hanadagi’s heart viz his powers (if she consumed the heart).

    I still think that Hanadagi’s special PB power could have something to do with emotions/intellection/meditation ( >> I don’t know how to describe it, something spiritual)
    So the “hypnotized” child could be an indication that Sara is behind the kidnaps.






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    Re: sara's bloodtablets

    Post by Bloodredhead on Fri Jun 24, 2011 2:28 pm

    nina wrote:
    You could be right on that … but Sara could have started the production of the new “breed” long before. Still doesn’t create any hole on the theory about the tampered tablets. But do you remember what the president of the pharmaceutical company said to Takuma when he found him in the dungeon; that Sara is planning to do something horrible. So the president already knew about her schemes. Since then, enough time has passed, so Sara had plenty of time to create a first batch of altered tabs using the blood of her prisoners. Isn’t obvious why??? It would be more logical for Sara to give Yuuki tampered tablets with pleasant taste and especially with different shape??? The alteration wouldn’t be easily noticeable even from the ignorant Yuuki?
    How logical is that? IF Sara has passed to Yuuki her spoiled tablets, isn’t obvious that she would like to remain a secret; firstly from Yuuki, further more from the others. For example … even if Yuuki didn’t notice the difference, Maria who saw Yuuki taking the tabs wouldn’t observe the difference on the shape?
    Sara doesn’t want to be found out her plans, in this stage.

    i believe enough time has passed for sara to change the tablets already and i think she is just improving them with the finishing touches in this chapter, ie. the taste of them.


    Spoiler:
    After all she is a great candidate cuz of her lack of experience with tablets and of course is one of her main targets … she (Sara) would be delightful if Yuuki’s NC will proved just a farce, and synchronously make Yuuki to seem like she is incapable to be the “leader” of the vampires! Do you think that all that talk between Yuuki and Zero about her NC and how she must get a hold of herself is irrelevant??? No… if Yuuki’s attempt collapses, then Sara will be the next Queen … (remember Cross words … someone will step in and will take the position of the head in the vampire society!).

    … so seems like Yuuki was the first who had to go … think about it … she wants to take Yuuki out of her way >> making Yuuki to seem unfit for the role of the head in vampire’s society >> the road is open for her to claim the throne. Of course she doesn’t want to unveil that she is behind Yuuki’s failure … would she? She doesn’t want to leave traces/evidence that she is the one who move the strings … cuz if she be found now, how she’s gonna spread the tabs to the vampires? She plays the good girl to the hunters and to Yuuki … she throws all the blame to Kaname, even for her crimes … isn’t transparent that she is working under cover and on multiple layers?

    The new batch of tablets, more tasteful and pleasant, is the catch, in order to lure the vampires to prefer her tablets over the old ones, hence and the different shape for been more detectable. As a marketing plan to sale better her product.

    agree with all of this nina. cheers cheers cheers
    making out yuuki as not a good leader works alot in sara's favour as it jeprodises yuuki's position and would leave it vacant for herself to take it.

    @juliet and sweet solace: excellent theories and evidence to back!!! juliet have to agree also with the childrens blood being used in the new blood tablets. makes alot of sense and gives and explaination why they are being kidnapped.

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    Re: sara's bloodtablets

    Post by Vanille-chan on Sat Jun 25, 2011 12:20 am

    I think Sara controls who drinks her blood.

    But I think that vampires are affected differently:

    * Noble, normal vampires and my beloved Zero: control immediately or soon.

    * PB: It will take long. I think the PB should drink the blood / tablet for a long time.
    In fact, I think Ouri was induced to kill himself. I think Sarah handled him bit by bit with her blood :3

    Well, the tablets are manufactured in one place. Yuki, Zero and all the vampires take the same tablet.

    Takuma said he wanted to drink the tablets. It means he has not proven yet.

    Zero had no change beyond the normal. And he will be the most affected by the tablets, I'm sure. So I think that Yuki did not take the new pills, yet.


    But if she took: OK, Matsuri, THAT WAS THE MOST COWARD WAY YOU FOUND TO SOLVE THE TRIANGLE. THAT´S ALL.

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    Re: sara's bloodtablets

    Post by nina on Sat Jun 25, 2011 1:34 am

    Vanille-chan wrote:
    Zero had no change beyond the normal. And he will be the most affected by the tablets, I'm sure. So I think that Yuki did not take the new pills, yet.


    But if she took: OK, Matsuri, THAT WAS THE MOST COWARD WAY YOU FOUND TO SOLVE THE TRIANGLE. THAT´S ALL.


    We are not supporting that Zero or anybody else have taken the spoiled Sara's tablets yet. If Sara had made already a batch of altered tabs, she gave them ONLY to Yuuki. That's why we haven't see signs on any other vampire. If Sara’s first batch of altered tablets had a disgusting taste (us we suspected cuz maybe she used the prisoners’ blood to make them) then she couldn’t give these tablets to anybody who already was familiar with the old ones, cuz immediately would spot the difference in taste and further more could realize that something is wrong with these tablets. But Yuuki since she never took tablets before she can’t tell the difference, hence and wouldn’t know that the tablets increased her thirst instead of tamed it.

    Also IF Yuuki's thirst is originated from spoiled tablets, thus the bite to Zero ... doesn't necessarily resolve anything ... confused





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    Re: sara's bloodtablets

    Post by Vanille-chan on Sat Jun 25, 2011 1:39 am


    Also IF Yuuki's thirst is originated from spoiled tablets, thus the bite to Zero ... doesn't necessarily resolve anything ... confused
    This solves, Big sis:


    "She wanted to drink because she was induced to do, ´coz Sara´s tablets increased her thirst.." End of game.

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    Re: sara's bloodtablets

    Post by nina on Sat Jun 25, 2011 2:04 am

    Vanille-chan wrote:

    Also IF Yuuki's thirst is originated from spoiled tablets, thus the bite to Zero ... doesn't necessarily resolve anything ... confused
    This solves, Big sis:


    "She wanted to drink because she was induced to do, ´coz Sara´s tablets increased her thirst.." End of game.

    It brings us back to the same point before the bite … if Hino wants to maintain the ambiguity she still can … not that I like it but ... she can.





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    *wants to sneak under these bed sheets*

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    Re: sara's bloodtablets

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      Current date/time is Wed Feb 22, 2017 1:21 am