The key, what purpose do you think it have

First topic message reminder :

We saw kaname giving yuuki a key, a very important item before leaving. But what that key do?
Since that is a real key, then, I think it must open something literaly. But what?

In my yume mind, I want to believe that is the key to their new house.
In chapter 72 we find out the mansion will dissapear because of volcano eruption (I think is kuran mansion because of the rose yuuki left behind). So, the kuran couple must live somewhere in the future. Since they want to start over, a new house is a good start.

But what do you think that key purpose is: to open a closet where is the solution of all problems?

ps: if this kind of thread exist already (i did not checked before) the mods / admin can delete it or move it somewhere else.

see....hmm or is it also possible that the hooded woman was Yuuki in the past..maybe she was reborn together with the twin hunter..because there's a curse happened when these first hunters ate the ancestor (the hooded woman's blood)..

there's one more poster, showing Kaname lying on the coffin with Yuuki hugging her.
maybe kaname might be killed or put to sleep again and yuuki will be the one waiting for kaname to wake up..

juliet wrote:

nina wrote:

sweetsolace wrote:

maybe the book will reveal more about the past. I think there are some information that is prohibited from being known to Yuki for example when she and Zero went to find out more about her human past, when Yuki touched the page concerning what happened to that snowy evening years ago the page burned.

http://www.mangareader.net/104-2153-29/vampire-knight/chapter-27.html
http://www.mangareader.net/104-2153-30/vampire-knight/chapter-27.html

maybe the "book" in this case then, will fully reveal yuki's past or kaname's past that he or someone kept from her?

in relation to this book
http://www.mangareader.net/104-2179-14/vampire-knight/chapter-51.html

it looks burnt

could it be the same as this "burnt page" picture of kaname and yuki?

Spoiler:

And also in that "burnt-pic" of Yuuki and Kaname Yuuki seems like wearing a hood. Could be related with the hooded girl who resembles to Yuuki??? >>>

http://www.mangareader.net/104-51058-5/vampire-knight/chapter-60.html

… many mysteries!

indeed what an observation, and that's the cover of the volume where we have Kaname's past unrevealed no? Also Nina, that's a veil there...it reminds a wedding veil..I think

Yes it seems like a veil, but the air of the pic it gives away a feeling of past tense… if you know what I mean …

sweetsolace wrote: I think there are some information that is prohibited from being known to Yuki

Not only Yuuki ...

In the past I thought that the pages were burning to prevent Yuuki from knowing about her past and her true nature before the right time. But now I have doubts…

Maybe a big part from Kurans’ history is sealed with the same “magic” as well and not only Yuuki’s past.

Here what Hanabusa says …

http://manga.animea.net/vampire-knight-chapter-33-page-19.html

“I searched and I searched … whenever I came across with something that could be a lead … it was burned, erased … everything was concealed”

And Hanabusa was searching about Kaname’s family. Well the death of their parents is directly tied with Yuuki’s sealed-memories. However it seems that there are not a lot of things known about the time when the Kurans were ruling as royalties, something strange for a royal family. No one referred to the Queen for example.

So maybe the lack of info about that period is due to the same “magic” … the past is concealed on purpose … ???

nina wrote:

juliet wrote:

nina wrote:

sweetsolace wrote:

maybe the book will reveal more about the past. I think there are some information that is prohibited from being known to Yuki for example when she and Zero went to find out more about her human past, when Yuki touched the page concerning what happened to that snowy evening years ago the page burned.

http://www.mangareader.net/104-2153-29/vampire-knight/chapter-27.html
http://www.mangareader.net/104-2153-30/vampire-knight/chapter-27.html

maybe the "book" in this case then, will fully reveal yuki's past or kaname's past that he or someone kept from her?

in relation to this book
http://www.mangareader.net/104-2179-14/vampire-knight/chapter-51.html

it looks burnt

could it be the same as this "burnt page" picture of kaname and yuki?

Spoiler:

And also in that "burnt-pic" of Yuuki and Kaname Yuuki seems like wearing a hood. Could be related with the hooded girl who resembles to Yuuki??? >>>

http://www.mangareader.net/104-51058-5/vampire-knight/chapter-60.html

… many mysteries!

indeed what an observation, and that's the cover of the volume where we have Kaname's past unrevealed no? Also Nina, that's a veil there...it reminds a wedding veil..I think

Yes it seems like a veil, but the air of the pic it gives away a feeling of past tense… if you know what I mean …

sweetsolace wrote: I think there are some information that is prohibited from being known to Yuki

Not only Yuuki ...

In the past I thought that the pages were burning to prevent Yuuki from knowing about her past and her true nature before the right time. But now I have doubts…

Maybe a big part from Kurans’ history is sealed with the same “magic” as well and not only Yuuki’s past.

Here what Hanabusa says …

http://manga.animea.net/vampire-knight-chapter-33-page-19.html

“I searched and I searched … whenever I came across with something that could be a lead … it was burned, erased … everything was concealed”

And Hanabusa was searching about Kaname’s family. Well the death of their parents is directly tied with Yuuki’s sealed-memories. However it seems that there are not a lot of things known about the time when the Kurans were ruling as royalties, something strange for a royal family. No one referred to the Queen for example.

So maybe the lack of info about that period is due to the same “magic” … the past is concealed on purpose … ???

@about the veil I know what you mean, also Solace mentioned that the pic is sad, perhaps due to impression of "burned", "burned" memories...of a concealed past? can be a very nice theory there. Past concealed on purpose (we saw it happening) so why not to say that it go further on? There is a thing with memories in VK. Vampires can erase memories to humans, purebloods can do it to their children (Yuuri to Yuuki), Kaname did it to himself (erased his own memories). Facts are burned in books, protected by spells..m..lot of magic used there, so why not? And that brings me back to Hanadagi's murder? perhaps he would remember? (I am twisting this idea to my mind, that Hanadagi's awakening was the call for action from Kaname's part. Why did Hanadagi's murder initiated this? So keep wondering what if Hanadagi knew about the past? and his elimination served that purpose as well...

nina wrote:
In the past I thought that the pages were burning to prevent Yuuki from knowing about her past and her true nature before the right time. But now I have doubts…

Maybe a big part from Kurans’ history is sealed with the same “magic” as well and not only Yuuki’s past.

Here what Hanabusa says …

http://manga.animea.net/vampire-knight-chapter-33-page-19.html

“I searched and I searched … whenever I came across with something that could be a lead … it was burned, erased … everything was concealed”

And Hanabusa was searching about Kaname’s family. Well the death of their parents is directly tied with Yuuki’s sealed-memories. However it seems that there are not a lot of things known about the time when the Kurans were ruling as royalties, something strange for a royal family. No one referred to the Queen for example.

So maybe the lack of info about that period is due to the same “magic” … the past is concealed on purpose … ???

interesting idea. So maybe this burn spell can explain the fact that there's no clear history behind the Kuran bloodline, just their position as royalty in the past, the information in the history books is either limited or base facts rather than the entire whole.

so the question that begs, why hide it? we have very limited information on how the past Kurans ruled, except that one of them took out the monarchy and started the association.

I think the "spell" was cast by someone... my suspicion is its Kaname, Yuki or someone else.

It seems the Kurans practice some sort of confidentiality and low profiling, or they're just full of secrecy. For example:

-there were deliberate attempts to camouflage the murder of Juri and Haruka (Kurans) and made it appear as suicide, again, why so? only Kaname knew what really happened when Rido attacked the mansion, or so it seemed, and later on he was the one who chopped him to pieces... what if Kaname made juri and haruka's death appear as suicide to hide the fact he has to explain what happened to Rido afterwards..which might lead to questioning who Kaname truly is as the ancestor?
I have another guess where its Asato Ichijou who covered up their death (since he took Kaname afterwards as his guardian) I think I recall that Asato also knows Kaname is the ancestor

-Rido's "banishment" from the Kuran family tree. Was there a clear explanation for this? I think not... but as Juri had said when Rido went back to visit them, Rido took away their first child. So she KNEW that their first child, "Kaname", was either murdered or kidnapped. And she might also know that the Kaname they have at present is the ancestor. So then the information they gave to the council after "Kaname's" murder/abduction was either that Rido killed their baby (this means they knew then that Kaname is ancestor) or Rido took their baby with bad motives. I lean more to the former, it seems if they informed the council that Rido did something bad and requested for protection, that means they have to explain what he did, which leads to questioning Kaname's murder too. So the council might know the present kaname was ancestor. hm I hope I made sense LOL.
(maybe this is what was referred to as the "greatest crime purebloods can commit", which is resurrecting an ancestor? it said it happened before Shizuka went missing and it sort of fits the time frame...)

-Yuki's past. It was also concealed as the event that happened after Rido attacked the mansion... all of this concealment leads to the question if its deliberate to camouflage the fact/suspicion that the present Kaname is the ancestor.
why hide the fact? someone's trying hard to prevent people from digging the past and discovering Kaname's past as ancestor, what if other information regarding his past is also concealed, such as Kaname's wife, his children, etc.?we haven't heard of it until now, and it seems like Kaname withheld that info from Yuki for a long time too, he didn't make an attempt to tell her who he truly is until the right moment when they were alone.

Also, it seems like Juri and Haruka knew that the present Kaname IS the ancestor, but they seem to be hiding that fact (they're not discussing it as far as the scenes showed), and I think they're pretending that he's their son... why?

most of the attempts for concealment is related to Kaname being the ancestor...why hide it?

I have a guess that what Rido did to him is the greatest crime they were talking about... but that's just a guess.

If that is so... it's either Kaname, in the past as ancestor, decreed that his life /existence as former King be erased from the history books, hence there was no record of him anywhere, and to mention any part of his life again afterwards would be a form of sacrilege of some sort....

juliet wrote:
And that brings me back to Hanadagi's murder? perhaps he would remember? (I am twisting this idea to my mind, that Hanadagi's awakening was the call for action from Kaname's part. Why did Hanadagi's murder initiated this? So keep wondering what if Hanadagi knew about the past? and his elimination served that purpose as well...

it could be, or it may have to do with his title as protector of the purebloods... hm i feel like there's more that remains to be seen here...
its a bit confusing for now but I think Kaname has more to reveal..

sweetsolace wrote: -there were deliberate attempts to camouflage the murder of Juri and Haruka (Kurans) and made it appear as suicide, again, why so? only Kaname knew what really happened when Rido attacked the mansion, or so it seemed, and later on he was the one who chopped him to pieces... what if Kaname made juri and haruka's death appear as suicide to hide the fact he has to explain what happened to Rido afterwards..which might lead to questioning who Kaname truly is as the ancestor?
I have another guess where its Asato Ichijou who covered up their death (since he took Kaname afterwards as his guardian) I think I recall that Asato also knows Kaname is the ancestor

I’ll go for the later … Asato knew about Kaname being the ancestor … here>>

http://www.mangareader.net/104-2169-43/vampire-knight/chapter-43.html

But as Kaname’s plan was to play along with the senate until he grows up and be ready to oppose them, he played along and about the conditions of his parents’ death. Also it should be kept it a secret Yuuki’s existence which was related with Juri/Haruka’s death. The suicide was convenient for Kaname too.
Either way the senate or some of them knew about Rido, cuz were they who took him after Kaname slashed him to pieces and kept him alive trying to regenerate him.
Furthermore it was the senate behind Rido … Rido might have his own revenge to deliver but they also wanted for Rido to take the place of the head of the Kurans.

http://www.mangareader.net/104-2164-28/vampire-knight/chapter-38.html

http://www.mangareader.net/104-2169-44/vampire-knight/chapter-43.html

So the death of Haruka and Juri came really handy for them as well and they were as guilty as Rido was. In fact they probably were the instigators of Haruka’s and Juri’s death. Ergo they had to cover up that incident under the disguise of suicide.

-Rido's "banishment" from the Kuran family tree. Was there a clear explanation for this? I think not... but as Juri had said when Rido went back to visit them, Rido took away their first child. So she KNEW that their first child, "Kaname", was either murdered or kidnapped. And she might also know that the Kaname they have at present is the ancestor. So then the information they gave to the council after "Kaname's" murder/abduction was either that Rido killed their baby (this means they knew then that Kaname is ancestor) or Rido took their baby with bad motives. I lean more to the former, it seems if they informed the council that Rido did something bad and requested for protection, that means they have to explain what he did, which leads to questioning Kaname's murder too. So the council might know the present kaname was ancestor. hm I hope I made sense LOL.

Yes, Juri and Haruka knew that Kaname wasn’t their child. Probably they figured out what Rido did cuz they knew who was laid in that mausoleum. So when Haruka found the baby it can’t be, not noticed that the coffin was empty. Furthermore I think from the last words he and Kaname exchanged is hinted that he knew pretty well who was the child, that they took care of.

“It’s alright … I’m saying this because I know everything… Even so it doesn’t change the fact that you have been our adorable son”

http://www.mangareader.net/104-2164-16/vampire-knight/chapter-38.html
http://www.mangareader.net/104-2164-17/vampire-knight/chapter-38.html

(maybe this is what was referred to as the "greatest crime purebloods can commit", which is resurrecting an ancestor? it said it happened before Shizuka went missing and it sort of fits the time frame...)

Maybe … the period fits.

-Yuki's past. It was also concealed as the event that happened after Rido attacked the mansion... all of this concealment leads to the question if its deliberate to camouflage the fact/suspicion that the present Kaname is the ancestor.
why hide the fact? someone's trying hard to prevent people from digging the past and discovering Kaname's past as ancestor, what if other information regarding his past is also concealed, such as Kaname's wife, his children, etc.?we haven't heard of it until now, and it seems like Kaname withheld that info from Yuki for a long time too, he didn't make an attempt to tell her who he truly is until the right moment when they were alone.

I think so too … that deliberate is camouflaged or sealed the past of the Kurans but not to prevent to be spread the information that Kaname is the ancestor…
1. Cuz Asato knew about this … so maybe there are other too who knew.
2. Kaname told it to Takuma …
http://www.mangareader.net/104-2164-27/vampire-knight/chapter-38.html

… if it was such a big secret then I don’t think that Kaname would reveal it even to Takuma cuz as we saw later that information “dropped” to Sara’s hands. Also Kaname told to Zero that he isn’t the real brother of Yuuki. All in all I think that if was so much important to keep his real identity secret, that he cast a spell to every document, then it’s hard to believe that he gave the info so casually.

I tend to think that IF there is a spell on their past then is because of Yuuki … or because of what happened and drove him to slumber. We have some info about the males of their genealogical tree but nothing about the females.

Also, it seems like Juri and Haruka knew that the present Kaname IS the ancestor, but they seem to be hiding that fact... why??

I think they didn’t want to talk about it cuz it was a delicate and hurtful incident and cuz Kaname didn’t knew anything about it up to a point. Since he sealed his own memories they probably figured that Kaname didn’t remember what happened, so they pretended, both sides, that Kaname was their real child.

I have a guess that what Rido did to him is the greatest crime they were talking about... but that's just a guess.

If that is so... it's either Kaname, in the past as ancestor, decreed that his life /existence as former King be erased from the history books, hence there was no record of him anywhere, and to mention any part of his life again afterwards would be a form of sacrilege of some sort....

There are some info about the king Kuran … it’s in their history books. I remember Hanabusa’s teacher taught them about it. What it seems that it wasn’t well-known is that the current Kaname was also the founder Kaname viz the king.
But as I said above this doesn’t seem to be so crucial. I think the only person which Kaname cared not to know about it before the right time was Yuuki.

sweetsolace wrote:

Juliet wrote: And that brings me back to Hanadagi's murder? perhaps he would remember? (I am twisting this idea to my mind, that Hanadagi's awakening was the call for action from Kaname's part. Why did Hanadagi's murder initiated this? So keep wondering what if Hanadagi knew about the past? and his elimination served that purpose as well...

it could be, or it may have to do with his title as protector of the purebloods... hm i feel like there's more that remains to be seen here...

My feeling is that Kaname killed Hanadagi and Hiou cuz they would represent a threat for Yuuki and for co-existence<<< which I think is related with Yuuki.
I base my impression on the statement of Hanadagi’s servant.

1. The Hanadagi family, “the protectors of the PBs” isn’t interested for fights over power.
2. That Hanadagi is sleeping 100 years already.

So the current Kaname is impossible to know him, so IF he was a threat then he comes from the past. The question is from which period though.
> He could be cooperated with the senate prior Kaname’s awakening.
> Kaname could know him from the wars against the PBs (ancestors) who turned massively the humans into servants, hence the title the protectors of the PBs since the rival side (viz Kaname+hunters) fought them.
> Hanadagi and Hiou could be involved to the incident which drove Kaname to slumber …

I’m leaning to the third choice cuz combine two hints we have for Hanadagi …
First his title “the protector of the PBs” and second this pic …

http://www.mangareader.net/104-19604-23/vampire-knight/chapter-52.html

… Hanadagi’s castle above the panel where Kaname is grieving over a shattered mirror … a grief which maybe had to do with his lost wife, and led him into slumber.

So IF Hanadagi had caused his despair then his motive could be also political (the protector of the PBs) cuz Kaname was the King who opposed and stopped the PBs. Either way the result of Kaname’s grief/slumber was the abolishment of the monarchy and the establishment of the senate which was in favour of the PBs.
Ergo IF there was such a scheme then it hit right on the mark.

@Nina, Firstly, I agree with most of your answers to Solace's questions , so I save us time there; just to say that Asato and Takuma seem to know Yuuki's existence (apparently from Rido) and there is the underlying plan to take her back once Rido has enough powers to reborn. After all that's why Rido send Ichiro there to wake Yuuki (with the blood) but as we saw it was not needed. So what they were covering with Juuri's and Haruka's suicide was actually their own plot.

Kaname complies to that as their is a show going on;
Asato was not supposed to help Rido (in Kaname's eyes)...so again Kaname could not expose Asato and say that his parents were murdered.
Kaname wants to break the spell so he waits Rido full resurrection and pretends collaboration with Asato.

Asato wants to Kill Kaname and also awaits Rido's awakening (muhaha, he would not dare hurting anyone before) that as Kaname's master will make Kaname a puppet. So there is a big chance that the past was erased by the council there (the archives) as we see Hunters then, had a collaboration with the council.

Kaname from his side must also have done the same (burn the archives) since one truth existed that of the council; he could not expose them before time. So it seems that all sides had their benefits there...

I tend to think that IF there is a spell on their past then is because of Yuuki … or because of what happened and drove him to slumber. We have some info about the males of their genealogical tree but nothing about the females.

IF there is a spell that goes even before that, I would guess the same as you Nina. The females are really kept in shadow..but we seem to know that Yuuki has Artemis, Yuuri had Artemis and perhaps IF we go back all the way, we could assume that the first Kuran lady had Artemis as well? (!!)

In the picture of Sarah and Takuma (cap. 73 p. 48) there is a little box besides Sarahs left hand and Takuma is holding a key... Maybe it is that box the key opens !!! But wait... What is inside the box ????

nina wrote:
But as Kaname’s plan was to play along with the senate until he grows up and be ready to oppose them, he played along and about the conditions of his parents’ death. Also it should be kept it a secret Yuuki’s existence which was related with Juri/Haruka’s death. The suicide was convenient for Kaname too.
Either way the senate or some of them knew about Rido, cuz were they who took him after Kaname slashed him to pieces and kept him alive trying to regenerate him.
Furthermore it was the senate behind Rido … Rido might have his own revenge to deliver but they also wanted for Rido to take the place of the head of the Kurans.

if the senate knew the events that happened in the Kuran mansion, and they knew Rido was killed, then the plot to take down Kaname was just beginnning to hatch
-casting spells on archives that contained what happened 10 years ago, including Yuki's past-- to cover up their plot
-taking Rido's chopped body and reviving him
-the cover up of Juri and Haruka's death
-placing guards on Juri and Haruka after Rido killed their baby, in the guise of protection. Maybe it was to fool them into thinking that the council was still doing their job?

So the death of Haruka and Juri came really handy for them as well and they were as guilty as Rido was. In fact they probably were the instigators of Haruka’s and Juri’s death. Ergo they had to cover up that incident under the disguise of suicide.

I think so too. The council was supposedly guarding the kurans after Rido killed their baby. I think this was so they would be reassured that Rido can't harm them, but some years later (maybe after Rido was fully healed), Rido went back to assault them along with the "dogs of the senate" as Haruka said it
I think the whole thing was planned by the senate to control Kaname (as he was growing up under Asato's watchful eye) and then to kill him when Rido was fully revived.

Yes, Juri and Haruka knew that Kaname wasn’t their child. Probably they figured out what Rido did cuz they knew who was laid in that mausoleum. So when Haruka found the baby it can’t be, not noticed that the coffin was empty. Furthermore I think from the last words he and Kaname exchanged is hinted that he knew pretty well who was the child, that they took care of.

“It’s alright … I’m saying this because I know everything… Even so it doesn’t change the fact that you have been our adorable son”

I agree they know about him, but I think they pretended not to know since Kaname's memories were reset and he was regaining them throughout the years, so I think they grew to love him as their own son.

I think so too … that deliberate is camouflaged or sealed the past of the Kurans but not to prevent to be spread the information that Kaname is the ancestor…
1. Cuz Asato knew about this … so maybe there are other too who knew.
2. Kaname told it to Takuma …
http://www.mangareader.net/104-2164-27/vampire-knight/chapter-38.html

… if it was such a big secret then I don’t think that Kaname would reveal it even to Takuma cuz as we saw later that information “dropped” to Sara’s hands. Also Kaname told to Zero that he isn’t the real brother of Yuuki. All in all I think that if was so much important to keep his real identity secret, that he cast a spell to every document, then it’s hard to believe that he gave the info so casually.

you're right there i didn't recall kaname saying it to takuma i think the spells casted on the archives were done by the council, as for the archives containing kaname's past.....

I tend to think that IF there is a spell on their past then is because of Yuuki … or because of what happened and drove him to slumber. We have some info about the males of their genealogical tree but nothing about the females.

yes I also noticed that.. i dont think kaname hid that past with a spell though. He withheld from telling it to yuki and there's a reason why... I think the "book" both showing up in yuki's child vampire side and the burnt page picture is their past together... Whenever Kaname is with Yuki she always observes that he has a lonely look on his face. So I think that yuki shared a past with him, a tragic one, something that he finds difficult to confront or tell her... Perhaps she doesn't remember it, or he does, and would prefer her to live in her happy dream..

There are some info about the king Kuran … it’s in their history books. I remember Hanabusa’s teacher taught them about it.

his teacher told him that the first king was a Kuran but that was all.. I wonder if Yuki knew that the king was Kaname? Aido was teaching her lessons about vampire society too.. She did not even suspect it? She does know that he is the ancestor...

Kaname complies to that as their is a show going on;
Asato was not supposed to help Rido (in Kaname's eyes)...so again Kaname could not expose Asato and say that his parents were murdered.
Kaname wants to break the spell so he waits Rido full resurrection and pretends collaboration with Asato.

I think the reason Kaname allowed it is because it also works in his favor as you said he needed someone to break his curse, and he needed time.
but i wonder if the council knew Yuki was alive. Rido knows about Yuki when he was awakened.. hmm i have a feeling they don't know it?

IF there is a spell that goes even before that, I would guess the same as you Nina. The females are really kept in shadow..but we seem to know that Yuuki has Artemis, Yuuri had Artemis and perhaps IF we go back all the way, we could assume that the first Kuran lady had Artemis as well? (!!)

interesting maybe it's a weapon intended for females. though I think that if it was a weapon used by Kaname's beloved in the past, he would likely pass it on to his female children if it would remind him of her..lol, although that sounds a bit odd that the females just naturally inclined themselves to using the weapon... or maybe the weapon was naturally made for Kuran females it was built for them.

juliet wrote: I save us time there; just to say that Asato and Takuma seem to know Yuuki's existence (apparently from Rido) and there is the underlying plan to take her back once Rido has enough powers to reborn. After all that's why Rido send Ichiro there to wake Yuuki (with the blood) but as we saw it was not needed. So what they were covering with Juuri's and Haruka's suicide was actually their own plot.

It seems so that they knew I’m not very sure but is possible. Maybe they let her be cuz she was useless until Rido’s body was ready to revive. He was in such incomplete state after Kaname’s attack that even if he was taking Yuuki’s blood wouldn’t be enough for him … something similar with Kaname’s ancestor case when Rido awoke him. His body was so damaged that the blood of the baby Kaname wasn’t enough.

But I think Rido attacked to the Kurans mansion having in mind to take Yuuki as sacrifice …

http://www.mangareader.net/104-2161-30/vampire-knight/chapter-35.html

His body was still wounded from Kaname, when he tried to awake him from his slumber and one of the reasons that he wanted to take Yuuki was to heal completely his body.

http://www.mangareader.net/104-2164-11/vampire-knight/chapter-38.html

He needed the thick blood of the Kurans back then as he needed it to revive his body when he went to academy. His plan was to give his blood to Yuuki, via Ichirou, before Yuuki awakes in her true nature in order to turn her crazy. Then he would sacrifice her to revive his original body. He had said so just before Kaname slashed him to pieces …

Rido: “After I rest, in order to regenerate fully, I will come for the rich Kuran blood that I need” << obviously meaning Yuuki.

http://www.mangareader.net/104-2164-20/vampire-knight/chapter-38.html

But Kaname gave his own blood.
http://www.mangareader.net/104-2163-32/vampire-knight/chapter-37.html

juliet wrote: Asato wants to Kill Kaname and also awaits Rido's awakening (muhaha, he would not dare hurting anyone before) that as Kaname's master will make Kaname a puppet. So there is a big chance that the past was erased by the council there (the archives) as we see Hunters then, had a collaboration with the council.

sweetsolace wrote: if the senate knew the events that happened in the Kuran mansion, and they knew Rido was killed, then the plot to take down Kaname was just beginnning to hatch
-casting spells on archives that contained what happened 10 years ago, including Yuki's past-- to cover up their plot

Maybe, but I don’t know if the nobles have such power. I think something like that requires a PB’s powers.
I have the feeling that at least the part that was concerning Yuuki was sealed with the spell from Juri, cuz if not then her protection by turning Yuuki into a human would be incomplete if it would be so easy to found out what happened that day … anybody who had access to archives could discover Yuuki’s existence and origins. So I tend to think it was part of Juri’s spell for dual reasons … to prevent Yuuki to know her past and anybody else who would like to take advantage of her.

sweetsolace wrote: I agree they know about him, but I think they pretended not to know since Kaname's memories were reset and he was regaining them throughout the years, so I think they grew to love him as their own son.

Yes and Kaname when he regained his memory probably he felt guilty/responsible for what happened to their firstborn. When Juri teases him by saying “you definitely take after your grandfather” … look Kaname’s facial expression …

http://www.mangareader.net/104-2161-27/vampire-knight/chapter-35.html

…cuz probably the grandfather that Juri was talking about was he, himself.

And that’s why he said that Rido’s existence was his fault …
http://www.mangareader.net/104-2164-21/vampire-knight/chapter-38.html

i dont think kaname hid that past with a spell though. He withheld from telling it to yuki and there's a reason why... I think the "book" both showing up in yuki's child vampire side and the burnt page picture is their past together... Whenever Kaname is with Yuki she always observes that he has a lonely look on his face. So I think that yuki shared a past with him, a tragic one, something that he finds difficult to confront or tell her... Perhaps she doesn't remember it, or he does, and would prefer her to live in her happy dream..

Either way, if the spell was from Kurans or the council the point is that there is a part from their past that seems unknown for the majority of vampires and hunters. Note that the hunters don’t even know Kaname’s involvement to the creation of the anti-vampires weapons.
So I agree … the part of the past that Kaname left out and didn’t reveal it to Yuuki could be related with the book and the key. Cuz somehow Yuuki should know about the rest of it.

his teacher told him that the first king was a Kuran but that was all.. I wonder if Yuki knew that the king was Kaname? Aido was teaching her lessons about vampire society too.. She did not even suspect it? She does know that he is the ancestor...

Hanabusa taught her before she learn about Kaname’s past … so back then she couldn’t connect the dots. Afterwards there was no time to talk with Kaname about it and as we saw later she was reluctant to reveal to anybody what she knew about Kaname. For example she didn’t tell to Cross that Kaname isn’t her brother but he is the awaked founder of the Kurans.

What I mean is that we don’t know how Yuuki thinks or what conclusions she made. The only thing we know is that she still trusts him and she is frustrated cuz Kaname seems not to give a damn if he is suspected from the entire world.
I think Hino deliberate keeping Yuuki’s silent … she left only hints:
- Yuuki’s outbreak with the butterfly wings.
- Her will to hold the “fort”.
- Her intention to find him.
- Her trust to him even if she saw with her own eyes the killing of Aidou-dono. (btw is really strange that this incident didn’t influence neither Ruka, Kain nor Takuma as we saw recently … very interesting! Lol)

sweetsolace wrote:

juliet wrote: IF there is a spell that goes even before that, I would guess the same as you Nina. The females are really kept in shadow..but we seem to know that Yuuki has Artemis, Yuuri had Artemis and perhaps IF we go back all the way, we could assume that the first Kuran lady had Artemis as well? (!!)

interesting maybe it's a weapon intended for females. though I think that if it was a weapon used by Kaname's beloved in the past, he would likely pass it on to his female children if it would remind him of her..lol, although that sounds a bit odd that the females just naturally inclined themselves to using the weapon... or maybe the weapon was naturally made for Kuran females it was built for them.

And don’t forget who named the weapon Artemis lol. It was Yuuki from the “future” or Kaname’s premonition if you like. It’s like a circle … Yuuki named the weapon; probably it was used from the Kurans’ females and ended on Yuuki’s hands again even before she awakes! Coincidence??!

My feeling is that the females played a significant role in the history and that’s why they seem to be in shadow thus far … as we have mentioned before maybe the whole idea of co-existence was introduced by the first queen and Kaname’s wife. Cross’s dream for pacifism was triggered from Juri also, another female with the same ideology.
IF so, then Yuuki’s existence and persecution as well, takes a whole other meaning. As I believe so, she will be the “key” for the co-existence.
Kaname’s words >> “I know the path that you’ll take” … “I don’t want to throw yourself in a lost cause” … “I don’t want to live that for a second time” etc.

I like our theory Nina!

sweetsolace wrote: if the senate knew the events that happened in the Kuran mansion, and they knew Rido was killed, then the plot to take down Kaname was just beginnning to hatch
-casting spells on archives that contained what happened 10 years ago, including Yuki's past-- to cover up their plot

nina wrote:

It seems so that they knew I’m not very sure but is possible. Maybe they let her be cuz she was useless until Rido’s body was ready to revive. He was in such incomplete state after Kaname’s attack that even if he was taking Yuuki’s blood wouldn’t be enough for him … something similar with Kaname’s ancestor case when Rido awoke him. His body was so damaged that the blood of the baby Kaname wasn’t enough.

The council and Yuuki;

1. It seems that the council knew Yuuki's existence back there or how else Rido would be released from them in order to get her? (when he was supposed to be under surveillance because he had attacked the Kurans about the killing of their first baby?) -and also another sign here that they also knew about Kaname, at least Asato did-.
But how would they dare taking Yuuki from the Kurans and apparently for what reason? -it's true that Asato wanted the Kurans out of hte way because they were the obstacle here in his plan to enslave humans -after all Asato wanted the purebloods killed and the humans slaves- BUT who would dare such an attack when they were wielding anti-vampire? Therefore Rido here (who could act as a puppet, had anti-vampire to finish them off and also was interested in that due to his own reasons was the superb candidate, acting as front cover).

2. Yuuki is delivered to Cross -again there was no vampire that even if the council wanted t, he/she would dare acting against Cross and at the same time young Kaname that was growing stronger, so they let it be until Rido would be fully recovered. I think the council -Asato mostly- bet a lot on Rido. Rido was supposed to get the Kurans down so that the council could do whatever they wanted. So

And don’t forget who named the weapon Artemis lol. It was Yuuki from the “future” or Kaname’s premonition if you like. It’s like a circle … Yuuki named the weapon; probably it was used from the Kurans’ females and ended on Yuuki’s hands again even before she awakes! Coincidence??!

Perhaps not at all, you certainly got my point there . What is Yuuki's relationship with Artemis, now ten thousand years after, but if we go all the way back to the past (ten thousand years ago), why is the last descedant of the Kurans also the first Kuran female to name the weapon? (because that literally happen) why? the broken mirror under her feet represents a reality (according to the meaning of mirror), which one?

My feeling is that the females played a significant role in the history and that’s why they seem to be in shadow thus far … as we have mentioned before maybe the whole idea of co-existence was introduced by the first queen and Kaname’s wife.

Yes I tend to think so too...I think that the idea for a change at the vampires, the co-existence plan and purpose was mainly due to the females part of the story...so perhaps (IF) Kaname's past wife was all in for co-existence and slow change and she died due to that reason - as Yuuri and Haruka- also died protecting such ideals since they were shielding the councils supposingly good plans with their participation and even submission- and that caused the despair to Kaname; a loss over a cause that was never fulfilled, and he went to slumber, still hoping though that perhaps all of that effort was not over nothing- that could explain a lot of gaps in the story and give another meaning to Yuuki's existence and role.

Okay a little this comment of mine, well it is what the title says but not what you guys have been talking about.

I believe the key could be either of these:
- The Key to Kaname's room (Because he mentioned about locking her up in there etc before he gave the key to her)
- The Cabinet
- A key that leads to more answers

About the memories, the book catching on fire when Yuki went to the Hunter Association, that was most likely because of the spell that Juri cast on Yuki which turned her human, that also prevents her from remembering, and any information about her as a Vampire, only people who DID know before that time would remember.

I do agree with everyone who says the Kurans like secrets XD

I do believe also that Yuki is the reincarnation of the Hooded Woman because when she was born, when Kaname saw her he said something along the lines of "I felt like I saw those Gentle Eyes before" I can't be bothered to find the chapter but he did say something like that.

So yeah that's my opinion about some things

To Kanamelover<3 (sorry that I critize your opinion)

It can be possible that Yuki is the hooded womans reincarnation since Hino has mentioned something about reincarnation in Captive Hearts, but this is another manga so you never know...

When Kaname said he felt he had seen those eyes before, he reffered to (i think) when he saw Yuki as a vision of the future. He also said that it was a premotion he often have, so maybe Yuki is going to go back in time or something like that again. And the hooded womans eyes isnt like Yukis, Yukis eyes are a lot bigger.

Lizz wrote:To Kanamelover<3 (sorry that I critize your opinion)

It can be possible that Yuki is the hooded womans reincarnation since Hino has mentioned something about reincarnation in Captive Hearts, but this is another manga so you never know...

When Kaname said he felt he had seen those eyes before, he reffered to (i think) when he saw Yuki as a vision of the future. He also said that it was a premotion he often have, so maybe Yuki is going to go back in time or something like that again. And the hooded womans eyes isnt like Yukis, Yukis eyes are a lot bigger.

Yeah I get where you are coming from, but, I meant maybe the expression of the eyes. But I get your point ;D

Very interesting discussions here. I'm eager for more clues regarding the key in the next episode.

Is Yuki the reincarnation of the hooded woman? Yuki as a baby says to Kaname "good boy" when he appears sad looking at a picture. Didn't the hooded woman also tell Kaname "good boy"? I have to wonder, regarding the similar phrases they use, is that significant? I think there are 2 possibilities:
1) Yuki is the reincarnation of the hooded woman or
2) Yuki is not the hooded woman & the hooded woman was simply a figure Kaname felt an attachment to & respect for but not a romantic love. Rather,Yuki went back in time (because Kaname recognizing the warmth in her eyes, remembering her in that flashback, &Yuki having named Artemis) and is in fact the mother of the Kuran clan...
These are some of my guesses, but whatever the case may be, it is my belief that Yuki is Kaname's true love and he must reunite with her. Perhaps the key opens to a room or cabinet that documents this Kuran family tree which shows that Yuki and Kaname are meant to be together...

I meant to separate 2)either Yuki went back in time and became mother of the Kurans or 3)perhaps she was from that time (rather than having gone back in time) and was the mother of the Kuran clan and thus a reincarnation of another person but not the hooded woman...

i think that key is of the coffin that kaname slept in or maybe that key is the key of some kind of diary in which kaname wrote every truth and ruka has that diary.

The key is probally for oppening that door that Kaname went with Yuuki to show her his past,that "Mausoleum"as Kaname said,or it's for some hidden" door that she'll discover after some chapters of dialogue between Yuuki and Kaname(after all that fight in chapter 83 is so out of paper for me! The writter could give us some information about:What's going on with Kaname?It's not only the excuse of HW sacrificing herself right?'i't has something about "his" past that includes Yuuki on it,in my mind if Yuuki was the Kuran's ancestor,it explains his caring for her,the part that he meet Yuuki again is missing...

lililovelilica wrote:The key is probally for oppening that door that Kaname went with Yuuki to show her his past,that "Mausoleum"as Kaname said,or it's for some hidden" door that she'll discover after some chapters of dialogue between Yuuki and Kaname(after all that fight in chapter 83 is so out of paper for me! The writter could give us some information about:What's going on with Kaname?It's not only the excuse of HW sacrificing herself right?'i't has something about "his" past that includes Yuuki on it,in my mind if Yuuki was the Kuran's ancestor,it explains his caring for her,the part that he meet Yuuki again is missing...

yeah i agree.........but still hino is way ahead of what we think.

interesting point of view...I've never thought about a new house for yume...so curious to see it xD
But I have another idea on it..
We all know that Sara asked for Takuma a sort of strong weapon that she hadn't during the Senate's time...
Maybe Kaname give that key to Yuki cause it's the key of the mausoleum...and in it there is a secret room where is conserved just that strong weapon that Sara has going to posses...
And Takuma knows about that cause in the past he was a near person a closer friend of Kaname, but we know that Kaname is not a stupid boy...he is smart but maybe one day Takuma finds out that secret weapon...
Little question after the Kaname death parents where did he live?! In his castle or in Takuma's house?! It's an important detail cause it would the first option well I'm sure that Takuma is involved in this key and mysterious weapon....(:

kialovejapan wrote:interesting point of view...I've never thought about a new house for yume...so curious to see it xD
But I have another idea on it..
We all know that Sara asked for Takuma a sort of strong weapon that she hadn't during the Senate's time...
Maybe Kaname give that key to Yuki cause it's the key of the mausoleum...and in it there is a secret room where is conserved just that strong weapon that Sara has going to posses...
And Takuma knows about that cause in the past he was a near person a closer friend of Kaname, but we know that Kaname is not a stupid boy...he is smart but maybe one day Takuma finds out that secret weapon...
Little question after the Kaname death parents where did he live?! In his castle or in Takuma's house?! It's an important detail cause it would the first option well I'm sure that Takuma is involved in this key and mysterious weapon....(:

nice imagination,i think that kaname's past wife sacificed herself just like hw and made a weapon to kill pbs becasue they were creating mess and for this kaname felt so so depressed that he went to the slumber leaving his sons and daughters to deal with it but they gave the power for peace to council and i think kaname is fulfilling his wife's wish not hw's.