Vampire Knight chapter 82 scalation

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Here is the link >>

http://tieba.baidu.com/p/1539502332

All the credits to chinese team!

First translation >> http://vampire-knight.livejournal.com/993114.html

All the credits to senbyafanatic!!!!

yuuki kiryuu wrote:After this first translations, all we get to see, eventhough the scanlations aren't accurate, is a very complex thing in the plot. We can surely say we've reach the climax so far..Kaname vs Zero. The fight we've been waiting is finally begining.

I know I said Kaname almost killed Zero, that is how I see it, I know Zero attacked him first and kaname said "Kiryuu-kun, that’s quite enough, don’t you think?" I don't think the way he handled things were right. He was waiting for Zero to start everything, he just thought he could deal with Sara first, but unfortunatelly Zero found him first. What is really interesting is when Kaname said: "I don't wanna be killed here", does this mean he wanted to get killed?, because we know Kaname is MORE POWERFUL, wise and he is a Pureblood, all things Zero isn't, and not even with all the blood Zero drank and the blood of all the purebloods he can stand to Kaname without being badly hurt, but he is a decent oponent. I think kaname knew this was going to happen, he never said a thing to defend himself from Sara's acusations. He wanted to increase that hatred. It's fine but is just not fair that Zero's the one to blame of everything cos he started the fight, he had a cause, no matter if you believe is right or completely wrong. One thing leads to another.

This is just my point of view, weather is right or wrong. I think Kaname is no inocent in this, but we are getting close to an epic fight..so don't underestimate Zero he might be drawn in hatred, bitter because he can't have Yuuki and many other things, he's still fighting for his beliefs but I guess everybody is hating him now, and annother thing that Kaname is always trying to control everyone (eventhough he's drank kaname's blood) that doesn't make him his "owner", he told him to drink his blood because he was the only one who could defeat Rido. So any ways I think in the next chapter a huge fight is going to take place. PS: Sorry for my english!

And I believe you shouldn't underestimate Kaname just because he wants Sara dead. You should know the fact that Zero is on Sara's side. After Zero had drank Sara's blood, he have become a vengeful, remorseless beast and wants Kaname out of the picture. I don't see Kaname controlling anyone... sorry. All I see is Kaname have kicked Zero's ass.

So I assumed that Sara must be safe for the time being inside the HA together with her harem and Takuma.

If so; what an irony … they are shielding a PB who turned a bunch of girls into vampires “right before their eyes”! And I cannot stop thinking the ruckus that they had done for this matter in the past … they considered that issue so serious that they imprisoned and interrogated Aido > a total innocent person for this.

And now? Now are “babysitting” Sara the real culprit not only of the harem but also of the murder of a hunter!

I know its very ironic and frustrating the whole situation here...can be seen weird for now but perhaps this is a part of the plot that has to be so at the current chapters so that it can can be twisted afterwards to attribute balance...apparently no matter how unjustified this "pampering" appears now, Sara shall pay one day for her actions cause justice has to arrive sooner or later for all.

What is really interesting is when Kaname said: "I don't wanna be killed here", does this mean he wanted to get killed?

yes it can be so, unfortunately for the ones that like Kaname, he is digging himself without remorse to serve a cause, not sure what cause but the guilt trip (because we know that Kaname is not bad, this is shown from his past) can send him there. The thing is time...Yuuki that we all know is the key here to get enough info and find a way to stop him before he decides to do anything irrational. Ruka is also a key in this because she knows a part of the truth that Yuuki ignores, and perhaps her interference in the lasts chapters (her connection with Yuuki) was not accidental...perhaps she is the one to speak and solve the mystery....

He wanted to increase that hatred. It's fine but is just not fair that Zero's the one to blame of everything cos he started the fight, he had a cause, no matter if you believe is right or completely wrong. One thing leads to another.

My opinion on this is that Zero would have better missing from the picture right now all together for many reason. He should no interfere. There is a war pulled here between Kaname and Sara and Zero's mistake is that he is ignorant enough not only to choose side but to choose the wrong side.

There are greater interests played here and domination over people is one of them at least from Sara's camp, now Zero's personal story > Zero can not see that is a dot in the map. This is his issue and inability > it has nothing to do with him not really, he is just used. Given that fact his inability to see the wider picture makes him dangerous for himself and others. So i won't excuse him for attacking Kaname. Its like a blind attack where he can not see where the real war is, at least shoot in the right direction.

So any ways I think in the next chapter a huge fight is going to take place.

I think that the rest of the hunters may interfere because it seems that the damage has already been done, not sure how much Zero can stand after this. Kaien may want to cool down things to avert the worst...I hope that this battle resolves here so that we can have and more development.

I LOVED the almost kiss scene with Kaname ! <3
"you have my poison inside you" <3 hmmm ? I wonder if Kaname's blood making it's move inside him is so pleasant xDDD b/c that's what my yaoi brain is telling me looking at Zero's face and Kaname so close whispering "that's enough, don't you think ? " xDDDD


Zero's emotions is takining the best of him. that's bad, yes. but I'll enjoy seeing him mature. as well as Yuuki's character. both their characters have blanks to fill. Yet Kaname like he have no blanks to fill. that's how Hino set them, no ?

I guess that's why I prefer Zero "the normal guy" to the Mr. Almost Godly and Perfect Kaname hehe xD still I like them both though.

Zero is still a suffering inexperienced teenager who needs yet to sort things out with himself and mature.
where Kaname is an adult ex-king who lived a millennium and had thousand years of wisdom plus the suffering.


Now what I don't understand is why Kaname lied to Zero about his responsibility of Zero's drama ?
I do believe Kaname is innocent. a good reason is to make himself look bad before Yuuki.

Zero heard the lie from Sara. and asked the suspect Kaname to make sure. and the suspect said yes and he put it in a way to manipulate Zero's feelings.

Zero didn't read the fanbook. and didn't read the manga. and of course the thought of Kaname wanting to ruin his own reputation wouldn't cross his mind either. he asked the said person a direct question to make sure, and the said person said yes I did it. and he asked why and the said person said his reason.

And once again as a reader I say I believe Kaname is innocent from Zero's family drama.
And I'm not trying to justify "Zero sideing with Sara" here, which is bad. but I'm justifying Zero's reason for attacking Kaname.
now in this chapter, Kaname repeated to Zero about the fact of him wanting/wanted to make him his weapon. thus assuring Zero of what he said earlier. why Kanameeee ? >_<


so instead fueling Zero's hatred and making him an enemy at the moment in his chess game with Sara.. and instead of wasting his precious time fighting Zero who now became a hindrance in front of killing Sara, why not tell the truth ??

as a reader I know Kaname calculates his every move very well. and evey action must have a reason behind it.
from my point of view this was not a smart move from Kaname. I mean about Zero's part not Yuuki's.
But from his point of view.. hmmm I guess there is a big question mark here. why he didn't tell him the truth by now instead of going along with the lie and fight over it ??


and why Kaname and Sara playing hide and seek ? why Kaname decided to come to the Academy in the first place? isn't to kill Sara ?? or maybe just to say hello and didn't even get the chance to say it b/c of people he knows so well they will interfere ?? or maybe to force her to take the next move which he expects ?


About Luka, I believe she'll be alright. god I love and respect that woman.
But I'm eager to know the effect of her action on :
-Zero ( wtf?! a vampire stepped in to shield me?!) though I'm almost sure she did it to save Kaname's image/reputation in Yuuki's eyes.
-Kaname (feels some guilt but move to where Sara is anyways )
-Yuuki ( My gentle Kaname almost hurt Zero but hurt Luka instead.. ah f*ck it all...I love you Kaname )
-Kain *is so worried over Luka to care about anything/anyone else*

Falc0n wrote:

About Luka, I believe she'll be alright. god I love and respect that woman.
But I'm eager to know the effect of her action on :
-Zero ( wtf?! a vampire stepped in to shield me?!) though I'm almost sure she did it to save Kaname's image/reputation in Yuuki's eyes.
-Kaname (feels some guilt but move to where Sara is anyways )
-Yuuki ( My gentle Kaname almost hurt Zero but hurt Luka instead.. ah f*ck it all...I love you Kaname )
-Kain *is so worried over Luka to care about anything/anyone else*

loved it...... and about yuuki so true...f--k it all she loves kaname and about kain,he will die for ruka.

iiXerxes wrote:Don't kill me yumes...

Agreed sassy. Kaname really is acting awful and cruel to everyone. I consider him a villain now. I'm sick of him...I think that Zero got power from sara because he and yuuki decided they needed to stop him. Zero obviously can't defeat kaname without power so he needed to drink her blood. When will you guys understand that he's NOT siding with sara? my god guys..come on. yuuki told him to temporarily defend sara and that's what he did. But in this chapter, he stated he's his OWN master. Why would zero ever side with a pureblood? I'm sure he only kept her from being killed so that he could get information from her. sara told zero that kaname ruined his life, which i think is true because Ruka ended up making zero say that in the illusion as well and didn't hear anything from kaname. but anyway, about the "gentle" part. It's been shown by someone that the translation is actually yuuki saying she wants ruka to return to her gentle side. she's not saying kaname is gentle. and "going to his side" most likely means going to kaname to go AGAINST him. and kaname DID want to kill zero as much as zero wanted to kill kaname...I think that kaname about to kill zero in front of yuuki is an awful thing to do to her since yuuki cares so much about zero. Kaname KNOWS she cares about him yet intended to kill him right in front of her. That's awful. Yumes might not be able to see it, but at this point, yume pretty much can't be the endgame. It looks like hino has been setting up zeki and it seems zero and yuuki might team up. Yuuki is going AGAINST kaname so I don't think there's any chance of her being with him in the end. I don't care if i get hate from you guys...This is how I'm interpreting it. I don't intend to argue with any of you since I've already gotten enough arguments from you guys before and they never ended well -_-

Hi,

I’ve been watching for the happenings of this forum and since you called out for us Yumes, and I happened to be a true blooded one, I’ve decided to join and please allow me to answer you head on..

You said: Agreed sassy. Kaname really is acting awful and cruel to everyone. I consider him a villain now. I'm sick of him...

>> doesn’t this just shows, how much you really hated Kaname to begin with? I take this as one based on your biased opinion, you did not even bother to show us the pros and cons to arrive at a reasonable conclusion. If he is awful and cruel to EVERYONE, then he wouldn’t have bothered saying sorry to the hunter whom he stepped upon to enter the HA’s HQ. He wouldn’t have bothered saving the entire night class and their families from the hands of the then corrupt council, he wouldn’t have bothered killing his own kind in order to preserve the human race during his time as an ancestor, if he’s indeed awful, he would have just let Sara be as she’s turning humans to vampire one after another. But he did not, he had decided to take upon himself the responsibility of protecting those people at the cost of his own happiness. Indeed, there are sacrifices made along the way, but those numbers are insignificant if only to achieve the common good – the peaceful coexistence of humans and vampires”. Please remember that he had killed those people with reasons.

- Purebloods from the past: he killed them in order to preserve the human race as those humans turned vampire can never stand in equal footing with those who are born vampire, hence, they’ll just become merely servants and those who were not shared of a pureblood blood will eventually become level E.

- Killing of Shizuka: he killed Shizuka in order to protect Yuuki when he was told by Shizuka that Yuuki’s value is that of a “piece” or “pawn” and that Yuuki will die in her place one day (Ch20 pg12-mangahere). But in exchange, he will destroy that which Shizuka abhorred (Ch20 pg27-mangahere).

- Killing of the vampire council: he killed them under the reason that the system it’s running is “a system that can no longer tell good from evil” in which case, is “a system that can no longer be used”(Ch43 pg7-mangahere). Don’t forget who it was that the council was protecting all along. Also note, how he silently apologized to Yuuki for doing such thing.

- Killing of Hanabusa’s father: the real reason is still on the shadows, but based on what Kaname cryptically said “who actually decided that one mustn’t violate the sanctity of the purebloods? And that is it really impossible to control the vampire society without them (Ch67 pg32-mangahere) – which shows that Kaname doesn’t want the standard of the vampire society to be based on the wills of the pureblood, who most if not all are actually “evil natured” and does not care for anything about coexistence – just like Sara and Touma, and even Isaya who would prefer to be on the sidelines.

- The recent killing of the other purebloods: he specifically told the previous head of the Hiou clan, that the reason to leave the purebloods as they are no longer there. You may wish to close your eyes from the truth surrounding the story but aren’t there a lot of level E as well as savage servant vampires at the start? Who do you think are the cause and the ones giving orders on those people, merely nobles? I doubt.. as we can see, nobles rely and are loyal to the will of their lords the purebloods.


You said: I think that Zero got power from sara because he and yuuki decided they needed to stop him. Zero obviously can't defeat kaname without power so he needed to drink her blood. When will you guys understand that he's NOT siding with sara? my god guys..come on. yuuki told him to temporarily defend sara and that's what he did. But in this chapter, he stated he's his OWN master. Why would zero ever side with a pureblood? I'm sure he only kept her from being killed so that he could get information from her. sara told zero that kaname ruined his life, which i think is true because Ruka ended up making zero say that in the illusion as well and didn't hear anything from kaname.

>>You seem to forget what had happened on Ch78 where Yuuki intended to confront Sara and Zero asked Yuuki if she intended to kill Sara and that he won’t allow her to do so even after knowing that it was Sara who killed Hanadagi and that she was the one behind the tablets of darkness. Yuuki specifically said, that she’ll go to Kaname after she settled the things in the academy – Sara’s involvement – but this did not materialize because she was stopped by him with all his EPIC ANGST and then Kaname arrived. In Ch79 we all saw that Yuuki subconsciously walked towards Kaname to go to him but was stopped by Zero, then the seemingly revelation / confrontation between Kaname, Yuuki, and Zero.

NOTE, even before the “agreement of Yuuki and Zero to protect Sara”, Zero already decided to protect her beforehand and as he pointed out in Ch82, it’s on his own accord being the master of his own life. If drinking Sara’s blood to get stronger and protecting her in exchange ISN’T SIDING or having alliance with her, then I don’t know anymore how it is called. Why would Zero side with a pureblood, Sara for that matter? Simple, is it not? Didn’t he believe that Kaname ruined his everything? It’s all for REVENGE – to kill Kuran Kaname!! And even though Sara might be the one behind the dark tablets and the killing of Hanadagi, but she’s also the one who conveniently offered him help to fulfill his wish, isn’t that thing emphasized on Ch81?

Also, arriving at your own conclusion as to why Ruka intervened on their fall is too presumptuous if not hypothetical. Indeed Ruka made that illusion to Yuuki but didn’t she feel bad for leaving her with such a bad illusion? which Kaname actually said thank you, as he wished that Yuuki would take him for someone who has gone mad. That in itself would show us that even Ruka herself, doesn’t want to do such illusion but has to do it anyway.

You said: but anyway, about the "gentle" part. It's been shown by someone that the translation is actually yuuki saying she wants ruka to return to her gentle side. she's not saying kaname is gentle.

>>I have a more reliable source and even though it’s not from the direct Japanese raws but rather from the Chinese translation.. it more or less goes this way “Please return that person who relies on Ruka-san’s gentleness back to me. We have to construe what she said base on what she earlier declared to Ruka, for Ruka to release herself (from the burden) -- which is by being on Kaname’s side and giving him support instead of her.


You said: and "going to his side" most likely means going to kaname to go AGAINST him. and kaname DID want to kill zero as much as zero wanted to kill kaname...I think that kaname about to kill zero in front of yuuki is an awful thing to do to her since yuuki cares so much about zero. Kaname KNOWS she cares about him yet intended to kill him right in front of her. That's awful.

>>This “going to his side” line actually started on Ch67, when Kaname left and Yuuki was alarmed by the way he said his goodbye, and thus continued on Ch68 where she went out of control at the thought of Kaname leaving her behind after they had promised of spending their long life ahead together. Then on Ch79, when she finally saw him again, she just walked to him hoping he’ll take her with him just as she did before. Then the fight on Ch81, where Yuuki said she hasn’t given up, after Kaname told her that he’d already abandoned her and that he’s a bad person. Then she made him recall their beastly promise on Ch52, and added that she won’t allow him to do whatever he wanted even if she has to cut him down. NOTE: She specifically wanted him to stop whatever he’s doing, and in that instance, the act of leaving her behind, and even asked him to pierce her heart with the sword.

Now, given the entire premise, where on earth can you draw such conclusion as her going against Kaname? Ch81 emphasized the main reason why, it’s because she cannot give up on Kaname, even if Kaname asked her to and even after she had heard the “supposed sin” he had committed against the Kiryuu family.. That’s why she’s determined to pass head on against Ruka and Kain.

As to Kaname killing Zero in front of Yuuki as an awful thing as for you is very subjective. Seems like you’re plainly reading the story based on your own biases. Remember that the one Kaname is plainly after was just the pureblood Sara who has been sheltered by the HA, who happened to have an agreement with Zero. Don’t forget that it was Zero who first made the attack using the awakened bloody rose and Kaname upon realizing that Zero’s bent on killing him, forgo with the evasion and decided to retaliate using his powers. For you, that is awful.. but what Kaname did was appropriate at that instance. If he’ll continue to let Zero be, then he wouldn’t be able to confront Sara. Moreover, Zero being Sara’s shield whose existence spelled DANGER AND TROUBLE, wouldn’t that also mean that he’s actually a dangerous person himself? There’s not much to gain if Zero’s to be let alive if he’s being brainwashed by Sara, and so he would only be in the way. Killing him would actually be favorable if Kaname is to achieve his goal, and by that, Yuuki might actually give up on him. However, I doubt that Kaname ever planned to kill him, if he does, he wouldn’t have to use his hand and would have just strike Zero with the sword in one blow and he would have just died instantaneously, then go to where Sara is.


Lastly, you said: Yuuki is going AGAINST kaname so I don't think there's any chance of her being with him in the end. I don't care if i get hate from you guys...This is how I'm interpreting it. I don't intend to argue with any of you since I've already gotten enough arguments from you guys before and they never ended well -_-

>>You talk too much, yet, you don’t even give justification to your own presumptions.. Moreover, your delusion doesn’t stand on solid ground. Try posting rationally and open up your mind.. Let us see the light of your thoughts and why did you arrive such interpretation, rather than feeding us with your hasty and baseless presumptions.. There are kinds of argumentation, if you want, I can give you an intelligent one or also a crappy one..

Be careful when calling for our kind, there are lots of us on the sidelines.. Calling us in denials? Try to re-read the story over again and look at the official front page pictures or cover pages, you’ll see whose ship is actually sinking.. This has been a one crazy long post so I’ll end my debut post here..

It seems that us ZeKi's are getting shot down for stating out own opinions...Same old same old with All Up eh? Why not respect us ZeKi's opinions and calm down a little bit? After all debating like this is pretty pointless, because we don't agree with each other anyway....

ruka,kain and kaname's love triangle is far better than zero yuuki and kaname's one.i mean ruka will do anything for kaname and kain will do anything for ruka.but in other one's situation is all greedy.zero wants his revenge,kaname wants to fulfill his goals and yuuki that idiot i don't understand what she wants.

SassyKnight wrote:It seems that us ZeKi's are getting shot down for stating out own opinions...Same old same old with All Up eh? Why not respect us ZeKi's opinions and calm down a little bit? After all debating like this is pretty pointless, because we don't agree with each other anyway....

lol.. it can't be helped.. that's the beauty of argumentation.. and don't we compose of the same people meeting in here? what we're asking is some nice discussion noh? rather than toppling us like were some kind of brainless idiots with no valid reasons which is more offensive...

SassyKnight wrote:It seems that us ZeKi's are getting shot down for stating out own opinions...Same old same old with All Up eh? Why not respect us ZeKi's opinions and calm down a little bit? After all debating like this is pretty pointless, because we don't agree with each other anyway....

then do not participate Sassy that simple, there are others that want to debate are you going to tell them to stop or are you going to dictate to them how to state their opinion? same old trick again with opinions? too late...if you can not back up your opinion that's your issue.

Cacile made a nice long post, do you have anything to state on the arguments rather than nagging about?

Go on with the discussions please!!

Zero's emotions is takining the best of him. that's bad, yes. but I'll enjoy seeing him mature. as well as Yuuki's character. both their characters have blanks to fill. Yet Kaname like he have no blanks to fill. that's how Hino set them, no ?

I guess that's why I prefer Zero "the normal guy" to the Mr. Almost Godly and Perfect Kaname hehe xD still I like them both though.

Zero is still a suffering inexperienced teenager who needs yet to sort things out with himself and mature.
where Kaname is an adult ex-king who lived a millennium and had thousand years of wisdom plus the suffering.

Zero has the weakness and Kaname the mysteries...that's the share here... both are interesting in their own perceptions and drama, perhaps it one day it would be interesting to see how Kaname feels about Zero - i think that he considers him in better way than Zero thinks or perhaps all of us.

Now what I don't understand is why Kaname lied to Zero about his responsibility of Zero's drama ?
I do believe Kaname is innocent. a good reason is to make himself look bad before Yuuki.

Zero heard the lie from Sara. and asked the suspect Kaname to make sure. and the suspect said yes and he put it in a way to manipulate Zero's feelings.

Yes it could be another reason but i can not believe that this can be the main reason, the problem is that Zero is the one that steps in Kaname's path first, I am not stating the excuses just the result, Zero suddenly throws himself in this war taking Sara's bait...from there on its logical that Kaname can not afford at this point revealing the motive behind his actions, he is avoiding true confrontations and reasoning like hell and at least from my part i can also see his suffering in all of these because in a sacrifice mode he is slowly "kiling" himself.

As hard as it sounds if there is greater purpose to serve here and Kaname is willing to take it to the end with his own self, I mean even using or burning his own self in the duration and in the journey, is he going now to stand to Zero's attitude? he shall try to pass through it trying not to uncovering himself and his plans. From the time that Zero becomes Sara's weapon willingly and Kaname is on the verge to sacrifice himself, its logical that he shall try to "neutralize" Sara's weapons if he can, not personally Zero, who ever Zero stands on his way and get through it to move to the next part of Sara's plan. The same behavior Kaname had with Kaien - this is what he told him that he won't let him stand on his way and we know that Kaname has no grudges against Cross - on the contrary...they were collaborators and shared Yuuki's responsibility, how tough is that to see that Kaname is far more determined than Zero or anybody else in VK?

Plus we do not know how he plans to finish it, I am not worried about Zero here, he shall recover, he throws himself in the game without a second judgement but perhaps this is his time to learn through these mistakes, to open his eyes and to mature, to get over with his own demons from the past and to choose just the right time to let them where they belong- act courageous...

Perhaps Kaname is planning his own demise through Zero here, I do not know .. but the greatest sacrifice comes from Kaname's part...and no one can see that? Zero acts as a barrier that must go down in order for Kaname to deal with the next part of his plan. Sad it sounds but right now this is going on...it would be best if Zero could step away from this fight, its not his fight.

ruka,kain and kaname's love triangle is far better than zero yuuki and kaname's one.i mean ruka will do anything for kaname and kain will do anything for ruka.

i really like Ruka and i turn to like her even more in the current chapters; she is willing to be there, really there and seems to be able to handle all of these that Kaname passes through and we know that she truly loves him, thus must be hard for her. I hope that she shall find happiness too...honestly Kaname should make her a gift after all these. Yes he should I shall keep Yuuki occupied haha...

SassyKnight wrote:It seems that us ZeKi's are getting shot down for stating out own opinions...Same old same old with All Up eh? Why not respect us ZeKi's opinions and calm down a little bit? After all debating like this is pretty pointless, because we don't agree with each other anyway....

Sassy, you need to understand that when anyone place an argument/opinion in a Public Forum, they will be countered by other posters... Ofcourse we may never agree with some posters in here - but the purpose of a Forum is to "Debate" and "State our own opinion" as long as its supported with facts and its Logical NOT simply being bias about "supporting your ship" than i personally dont see what's wrong with debating..

Since WHEN do everyone agree with each other in "Forums" anyways?? What you said "Debating like this is pretty pointless"... than WHY are forums created in the FIRST place??... Forums are not only for "agreeing with each other opinions" but its also about:

1) Hearing other opinions
2) IF we disagree, we comment back an argument to support OUR OWN opinion... And further on...
3) We dont come in here to "nag" and say you are being unfair to our ship etc...

If you are not up for this level, than you shouldnt be discussing in this forum or any forums, until you learn to respect other posters - and not post a "OPINION" saying we are not being fair to Zeki's... A forum is open for "Discussions"... If you dont like you can ignore.. IF you want to comment, than do it in a proper way and not say what you just said in here...

lucykaede wrote:and yuuki that idiot i don't understand what she wants.

I think what Yuuki WANTS is pretty obvious... from her "action" and "her words"... To me: "She wants Kaname back" and "She wants to go with him". I dont see her "siding with Sara" on my end... (that's just how i see it)...

But to those that disagree with me, lets just say we'll wait for the author to make it more clearer to see who's right/who's wrong in the end...



@ Chacile - I co-sign with your AWESOME post This is one of the BEST comments i've read in here - excellent job in providing the background to the whole Vampire Knight story!! (with supported evidence) And without a doubt - I agree with you since what you said is exactly what i feel/see on my end too

And btw - Welcome to this forum!!

Meleas wrote: At this point Zero has no reason not to believe Kaname that he brought "misfortune" over his family.

Falc0n wrote: Zero didn't read the fanbook. and didn't read the manga. and of course the thought of Kaname wanting to ruin his own reputation wouldn't cross his mind either. he asked the said person a direct question to make sure, and the said person said yes I did it. and he asked why and the said person said his reason.

I’ll just take the above quotes as references to address overall my view for Zero’s actions and why I find his stance unjustified (note: actions, not emotions) .

Is it true that Zero most likely doesn’t know the whole truth about Shizuka’s incident (as for example that she escaped with her lover) and Kaname certainly didn’t cleared this up … on the contrary he presented the situation maybe even worse from what Sara already had told him.

Did Zero have a way to find out what really happened? No … I do not think so since Kaname refused to defend himself.

However did Zero have enough hints and even evidence into his hands to question the whole situation and DO NOT “trust” Sara; and certainly to not drink from her and becoming her tool/weapon at least by killing Kaname?

The answer is yes and here lies my reasoning for criticizing and being disappointed from Zero’s actions/decisions and not so much by his emotions which on a certain degree are justified.

Indications that Zero must have taken under consideration:

1. At the ball where Ouri and a hunter have been killed he smelt fresh blood on Sara and after he found out about what happened he should at least have been alarmed that Sara was a strong (if not the stronger) candidate of being the culprit of these two murders.

2. He knows about Sara’s harem and even if he and the rest of the hunters couldn’t do anything about it still her action is repulsive and especially for Zero considering his past.

3. He knew from long ago that Sara had set her eyes on him >> she told him in an arrogant way that she wished to become her puppy.

4. He saw with his own eyes what Sara’s tablets caused to the users and I think it is not difficult to imagine what this issue can bring …

5. Another evidence that should have stopped him and make him think twice at least, is Hanadagi’s guard testimony … She revealed Sara’s involvement … that it was Sara the one who attacked first at Hanadagi’s coffin and not Kaname.

Sara lied because when she rushed at the HA asking for shelter not only she didn’t keep quiet but she tried to frame Kaname for her own crimes…

And Kaname; what he did? He has taken upon him the responsibility of all the killings including Ouri’s!

Here what Zero told to Yuuki about Hanadagi>>
http://www.mangareader.net/vampire-knight/76/19

What I’m trying to say here is that if Zero WANTED to see the big picture and be really the master of himself he had the indications to do so … is right there in front of him to see that Sara and Kaname are lying but the BIG DIFFERENCE is that Sara’s lies are functioning for her own benefit absolving her from crimes that provenly has committed whereas Kaname’s lies are convicting him.

So I’m asking … a logically thinking person, who from the two liars should have been more wary of; the one who is convicting himself or the one who is playing the angel with obvious benefits?

It’s just simple logic that Zero is unable to show.

Does he have every right to hate Kaname for what he supposedly brought to him and to his family? Yes …

Does he entitle to act so emotionally NOW serving Sara’s objective by trying to kill Kaname NOW? For me certainly not; simply cuz he is acting so selfishly by putting his personal vendetta above the greater good … he just didn’t correspond to the expectations that his role as a main character demands.

It’s like Juliet said >>

There are greater interests played here and domination over people is one of them at least from Sara's camp, now Zero's personal story > Zero can not see that is a dot in the map. This is his issue and inability > it has nothing to do with him not really, he is just used. Given that fact his inability to see the wider picture makes him dangerous for himself and others. So i won't excuse him for attacking Kaname. Its like a blind attack where he can not see where the real war is, at least shoot in the right direction.

Perfectly said. I think this sum up the gist of why Zero is failing.

Note that I’m talking for the time being cuz I still believe that Zero can rise above all this and eventually to stand on the expected high. But currently he’s proven too “small” and maybe his “smallness” becomes more noticeable cuz he inevitably is compared with Kaname who sacrifices himself and his own happiness sealing and burying his own emotions for the greater good.

Falc0n wrote: Zero is still a suffering inexperienced teenager who needs yet to sort things out with himself and mature.
where Kaname is an adult ex-king who lived a millennium and had thousand years of wisdom plus the suffering.

So very true. Isn’t so fair for Zero to be compared with Kaname but I think is inevitable.
However I wasn’t expecting from Zero to stand on the same level as Kaname or be so levelheaded but what I was expecting from him is to show development from the teen who was consumed from his hatred to a young man who can control better his emotions and act more based on logic.

And here I shall compare him with Yuuki (it’s fairer for him) … Still while we see Yuuki’s maturation where is Zero’s? Where are the steps that he supposedly should have made forward from the bitter impulsive boy that we first met?
I cannot see any step and frankly I could say that he had done steps back with his recently actions.

Now what I don't understand is why Kaname lied to Zero about his responsibility of Zero's drama ?
I do believe Kaname is innocent. a good reason is to make himself look bad before Yuuki.

Zero heard the lie from Sara. and asked the suspect Kaname to make sure. and the suspect said yes and he put it in a way to manipulate Zero's feelings.

so instead fueling Zero's hatred and making him an enemy at the moment in his chess game with Sara.. and instead of wasting his precious time fighting Zero who now became a hindrance in front of killing Sara, why not tell the truth ??

Yes this is a very good question. We do not why but I’ll state only my assumption.

When I first saw Kaname’s stance there I thought that he was “targeting” Zero … that he wanted to fuel his hate for some reason. But now I think that his main goal was Yuuki there and not Zero.
I’m basing my assumption on Kaname’s later reaction regarding Zero’s choice to drink Sara’s blood (he wasn’t happy about it and as we saw certainly not because he was frighten of Zero’s power lol) and his stance in the battle where he tried to stop Zero. In other words it seems that he didn’t want Zero siding with Sara.

So I’m thinking … even if Kaname had denied that he was responsible for Zero’s drama does anyone believe that this would have made any difference for Zero at all?
Personally I’m absolutely sure that in the state that Zero was there and considering his character, wasn’t, not even a chance to change his mind. << This is something that I had said before even we see what stance Kaname would have had … when all we were wondering if Kaname will defend himself or confirm Sara’s sayings.
We all know Zero’s hatred for Kaname … he was waiting to kill the worst PB of all for a long time now … he just needed an excuse and that excuse was offered from Sara. I just couldn’t believe that Zero would have let this long awaited chance to slip of his hands and maybe this was Kaname’s rationale as well.

Furthermore even his actions prior Kaname arrives at the Academy indicate that Zero had took his decisions the moment he heard Sara >>

1. He covered Sara’s involvement with the tabs to Cross.
2. He said to Yuuki that he won’t let her lay a hand on Sara.
3. He ignored gaily Hanadagi’s guard testimony.

Some fans supported that all of that it was just to gain time and search for info but I didn’t believe that neither for a second and as it proved I was right about it.

Zero didn’t seek for answers or info, but only for revenge, simply because what Sara told him about Kaname reinforced the fixed opinion that Zero had for Kaname long before. So as result he closed his eyes and ears to everything around him…

That’s why I’m thinking that even if Kaname had tried to present the truth it would have been pointless … so he chose to “use” the situation and Yuuki’s bond with Zero in order to achieve his other priority > to blacken himself in Yuuki’s eyes and make her to give up on him exploiting Zero’s emotional burst something that even Ruka used in her illusion as we saw.

In short the only thing that could have achieved by telling the truth would have been to reinforce Yuuki’s determination to follow him rather than change Zero’s mind and his decision to avenge.

Juliet wrote: i really like Ruka and i turn to like her even more in the current chapters; she is willing to be there, really there and seems to be able to handle all of these that Kaname passes through and we know that she truly loves him, thus must be hard for her. I hope that she shall find happiness too...honestly Kaname should make her a gift after all these. Yes he should

He certainly should! Haha

However that baka Kaname doesn’t have eyes for any other woman but Yuuki *sigh* … bad news for Ruka, bad news for us too

I shall keep Yuuki occupied haha...

Good luck with that … I wouldn’t dare to confront Yuuki right now … no way! She demands her man back, so I wouldn’t mess with her hahaha.


@Chacile you nailed it!!! Co-sign every single word!

Okay well personally I feel both guys are being misunderstood a lot this chapter. I don't think anyone will like this post, but I feel some things need saying.

Firstly Zero. He had a legitimate reason to go and confront Kaname, as Kaname entered the HA without permission, true other things may have been going through his head as well, but as a hunter Zero had a right to go and step in Kaname’s way for coming in.

About Zero’s selfish reasons, sorry but Zero is one of the most unselfish characters there is. Let’s think about this, when he spoke to Kaname his first words when he heard what Kaname said weren’t “why did they do that to me” a line you’d expect of a selfish person really, he goes “why did you get Ichiru involved?” His concern was about his twin brother (who I might add betrayed him for one), not himself. Zero isn’t one to think of himself, in this way him and Kaname are similar. They will throw themselves in with little regard for their own safety or wellbeing. Not a trait you’d expect from some who is selfish.

Zero doesn’t know all the facts yet, yeah that’s probably bad of him to act not knowing everything but it’s not Zero’s fault he doesn’t know all of it. He knows what he has been told, so he is working off that, he can’t take action on something he does not know about. His powers don’t reach to mind reading.

Secondly Kaname. He had a right to go for Zero considering he was defending himself from someone who was going in for the kill. I see people saying Kaname had no right to nearly kill Zero in front of Yuuki, well then what if she had walked in when Zero had his vines around Kaname? Can’t we say the same thing about Zero? O.o If Zero had killed Kaname there, even if Yuuki hadn’t seen it, would that have been fine? I don’t think so, as that’s going to be cruel on Yuuki too.

I think a lot of people also aren’t seeing how much Kaname has been pushing Yuuki away, before Kaname started fighting back against Zero who did Kaname think of? Yuuki. I think this is a good indication of why he started fighting back on top of the reason Zero was going in to kill. Hurting Zero would greatly help in pushing Yuuki further away if you ask me. Also how people can condemn Kaname when half of the facts are missing I find extraordinary. How do you make a well-rounded judgement with only half the facts and evidence? Also from what we have seen of Kaname in the past he has always had good intentions and wanted to help people mostly humans, and considering he says he is doing what HW wanted and her main aspiration was co-existence is it really hard to believe this is what Kaname is still striving for? Yes his methods are extreme, but can we really judge them when we for one don’t know all the facts, and can’t make any solid conclusions over what Kaname is doing? I just feel that’s jumping the gun really.

I feel a lot of people are being far too harsh on the opposite guy, and being far too lenient with the guy from their ship. It is understandable as we usually understand our boy better than the other, but so far both boys have done things that they can’t hold their heads up high for. Both have done things wrong, yet both aren’t as bad as some are painting them. We’ve seen both of the boys kinds sides, how they have done good, etc, yet the sufferings they have been through have hardened their hearts to an extent and that’s totally understandable really. Nothing in this story is black and white, especially the boys. It’s very much grey this story and its characters.

Just some food for thought. Don’t expect a lot of agreement really with this one.


@iiXerxes: Just wanted to comment on a few things you said in your post.

yuuki told him to temporarily defend sara and that's what he did.

Zero decided before he spoke to Yuuki to protect Sara, he even said to Yuuki he would not let her hurt sara. Zero made the decision himself for his own reasons. He didn’t do it on Yuuki’s say so.

Why would zero ever side with a pureblood?

and it seems zero and yuuki might team up.

You say Zero wont team up with a pureblood then say he will team up with Yuuki who is a pureblood. That’s contradictory.

I think that kaname about to kill zero in front of yuuki is an awful thing to do to her since yuuki cares so much about zero.

I touched on this above but I will repeat myself. Yuuki cares about Kaname too so isn’t it awful as well that zero went in the kill him as that would hurt Yuuki too?! If Yuuki had walked in when Zero had his vines wrapped around Kaname wouldn’t that have been cruel for the same reason?

Yumes might not be able to see it, but at this point, yume pretty much can't be the endgame.

This is an opinion and not a fact. So how you state it as a fact I do not understand. Why can’t Yume be endgame? Why is it impossible? You make this statement yet do not back it up. You do not state the why to your argument. Why do you think this? If you would please come back, and explain it, that would be most helpful.

It’s funny really, people are asking for others to respect the Zeki ship then Zeki’s come out with this comment which is less than respectful to the Yume ship. If you can say this then you can’t really not expect some Yumes to say Zeki is impossible.

Yume impossible…..tell that to Yuuki. She sure seems to think that her and Kaname can work this out, otherwise why would she want to go back to his side? O.o And for those who come back with the counter of that Yuuki means to stop him, going back to someone’s side indicates literally doing that, being with them etc. And also back is past tense, when Yuuki was with Kaname what were they? A couple.

SassyKnight wrote:It seems that us ZeKi's are getting shot down for stating out own opinions...Same old same old with All Up eh? Why not respect us ZeKi's opinions and calm down a little bit? After all debating like this is pretty pointless, because we don't agree with each other anyway....

Sassy, respect goes both ways.

Recently I have seen little respect for my ship from some Zeki's.(Not saying all Yumes respect the zeki ship as I know some don't). It makes me then think why should i respect them and their ship, when they won’t respect mine? Honestly I’m getting tired of being respectful to others who don't show the same curtsey back.

My advice sassy is that if you feel you aren’t being respected and get upset about it, why not just ignore it? Making posts like above are pointless really. No-one is going to listen while they feel their own ship is under attack and not being respected.

Zero decided before he spoke to Yuuki to protect Sara, he even said to Yuuki he would not let her hurt sara. Zero made the decision himself for his own reasons. He didn’t do it on Yuuki’s say so.

Yes but he's not protecting sara because he's siding with her. I see it more so that he can get information from her because she told zero what kaname did.

You say Zero wont team up with a pureblood then say he will team up with Yuuki who is a pureblood. That’s contradictory.

Don't take it so literally. That's different seeing how Zero probably still has some feelings for Yuuki. It also appears he's starting to consider her being the same person as human Yuuki therefore he's more likely to side with her.

I touched on this above but I will repeat myself. Yuuki cares about Kaname too so isn’t it awful as well that zero went in the kill him as that would hurt Yuuki too?! If Yuuki had walked in when Zero had his vines wrapped around Kaname wouldn’t that have been cruel for the same reason?

Most likely not because Yuuki was just attempting to kill kaname before with artemis...Wasn't she just talking to kaname about their promise that if yuuki left him, she'd kill him with her hands or he'd kill her. She said she'd do anything to stop him even if it's hurting him badly.

This is an opinion and not a fact. So how you state it as a fact I do not understand. Why can’t Yume be endgame? Why is it impossible? You make this statement yet do not back it up. You do not state the why to your argument. Why do you think this? If you would please come back, and explain it, that would be most helpful.

Yes sorry. It is my opinion. But I'll explain why I don't think it's going to be very possible. First of all, my main reason is that yuuki already ended up with kaname at the end of 1 arc. It doesn't make much sense to me for hino to end another arc with her yet again leaving with kaname. Second of all, at this point, do you really see her going to kaname after he confessed to ruining zero's life and murdering purebloods? I definitely don't. I honestly think that her being with kaname throughout the story was basically for plot. If she hadn't left with kaname for the kuran mansion then most of the plot that happened, wouldn't have. Not to mention that half of the time yume is together, they look unhappy. and have you seen much yume recently? I haven't. All these recent chapters have been zeki development. When she saw zero upset after kaname confessed what he did, she completely ignored kaname and comforted zero. She's been talking nonstop about how she needs to stop kaname. I haven't heard her say she WANTS to go to his side for a long time. Sure she said "I need to go to his side" and yes it's most likely kaname but I don't think you're viewing it the right way. I feel like she may have told Ruka that just to get to him or she needs to go to his side SO she can stop him. She's not stupid and isn't going to act like nothing happened here just to go to his side. With all the zeki, do you honestly think its all for nothing? zero and yuuki have come much closer to each other compared to when she first arrived at cross academy after having left with kaname. She can act more herself around him and they've developed alottt more. This isn't really relevant but I've never really seen her act herself around kaname and it's said that you can act yourself around the one you "truly" love. She's always been completely comfortable with zero and may not be AS comfortable with him now but she's returning to her old self it seems. I'm sorry but I rarely see yuuki smiling at kaname and mostly zero.

I don't really wanna hear that zekis are disrespecting your pairing alot because half the time I come on here looking at a yume's reply, it's usually them being rude to a zeki. Not saying that for all of you, but some zekis on here agree that they're targeted. I usually end up commenting after I've seen a yume being disrespectful to what someone may say about zeki or zero. I'm just tired of it. I try laying off on commenting here because I feel I'll be attacked every single time and even if I make a single comment and nothing else.. o_O I will admit I've been rude to you guys and apologize but some of you can be rude to me as well and feel it's not really that fair.

iiXerxes wrote:
Yes but he's not protecting sara because he's siding with her. I see it more so that he can get information from her because she told zero what kaname did.

I didn't say Zero was on Sara's side, I said that Zero had already decided his own course of action before he spoke to Yuuki. Your post made it out like Zero did it all on Yuuki’s say so which isn’t the case. He made his own decision for whatever reasons he had.

I don’t see Zero as on Sara’s side as they are moral at odds and won’t be working with each other for long if you ask me. I see at the moment it’s like a mutual agreement, sort of I’ll scratch your back if you scratch mine. Everyone makes agreements in war etc for certain periods of time, usually it’s to bide their time for an opportunity or to refuel themselves for a later battle. Zero could be doing this but we will have to wait and see.

Most likely not because Yuuki was just attempting to kill Kaname before with artemis...Wasn't she just talking to Kaname about their promise that if yuuki left him, she'd kill him with her hands or he'd kill her. She said she'd do anything to stop him even if it's hurting him badly.

This is where we will mostly differ. I doubt Yuuki could see someone important to her get killed by another she found important. Sorry it’s not in her character to be fine with it at all. I don’t think you can deny that Yuuki cares for Kaname, as its been shown pretty clearly.

There is a difference between doing it yourself and watching someone else do it.

Yes sorry. It is my opinion. But I'll explain why I don't think it's going to be very possible. First of all, my main reason is that yuuki already ended up with kaname at the end of 1 arc. It doesn't make much sense to me for hino to end another arc with her yet again leaving with kaname.

Well it makes sense if you want your love theme to be showing how a couple overcame every obstacle to stay together, and at every turn worked through it to stay as a couple in the end. I think that’s quite a sweet message hino could send out honestly. The whole Love conquerors all.

Second of all, at this point, do you really see her going to kaname after he confessed to ruining zero's life and murdering purebloods? I definitely don't.

One we don’t know Kaname’s reasons as of yet, so I find it hard to figure how we can make judgements condemning him with only half the facts before us. It’s a tad too much of jumping the gun I find. Not saying Kaname is an angel as he’s done things that he shouldn’t have, but so has every character yet we don’t condemn them due to we know their reasons. Shouldn’t people offer Kaname the same curtsy?

If you’re referring to the Shizuka incident, then you will find there are inconsistencies in what Kaname said to Zero. Kaname said he released Shizuka to have her revenge yet Shizuka said herself to Ichiru that she left her cage with her lover? So how can it be that she was let out to have her revenge on the Kiryu’s if her lover was still alive? O.o There is inconsistency here. One I think hino purposefully did to make us question more into Kaname’s actions etc.

and have you seen much yume recently? I haven't. All these recent chapters have been zeki development.

With Yume it’s not been a lot but they had their moments. I speak about the whole Kaname brushing the blood off Yuuki’s cheek and their eye moment. Then we had the whole “My Kaname” bit. Just cos they aren’t cuddling of a couch doesn’t mean Yume is dead.

When she saw zero upset after kaname confessed what he did, she completely ignored kaname and comforted zero.

One, at the start of this scene Yuuki completely ignored Zero and moved towards Kaname. Wasn’t till Zero grabbed her arm that she turned to notice him again.

Two, of course she comforted him. It wasn’t the real Kaname before her, so chasing shadows would be pointless I think, and also what heartless person leaves someone who is in obvious distress? O.O It wouldn’t be Yuuki if she just ran off, Zero is important to her, so she’d naturally be concerned for him.

I don't think you're viewing it the right way.

Erm……I have the right to view it the way I perceive it, just like you have the right to view things the way you perceive them. There is no right way of viewing something, as we all have our own interpretation, moral grounds, views, opinions etc. Sorry but you can’t force me to see it the way you consider right. And at the end of the day who’s to say your way is right?

All I am saying really is maybe you shouldn’t condemn Kaname so quickly like you seem to. You give Zero the benefit of the doubt so shouldn’t you do the same for Kaname? Like some people who give Kaname the benefit of the doubt should probably do the same for Zero too, to be fair really.

She's not stupid and isn't going to act like nothing happened here just to go to his side.

I don’t expect Yuuki to go back to Kaname’s side like everything is fine etc. She still has things she wants answering from Kaname, she’ll confront him again probably, I’m thinking maybe next chapter. But she wants to go to him and find her answers, why search so much for these answers to the point of your willing to hurt your loved one if you don’t care? Yuuki is showing quite emotional outbursts really when it comes to Kaname recently. It over spills and she can’t control it, that shows how important this is to her and how important she sees Kaname. You don’t get worked up over nothing or nobody.

With all the zeki, do you honestly think its all for nothing?

I could ask the same thing about Yume. Why all that Yume for it not to be the endgame couple? To me Hino wasted loads of time and pages there, which she could have used for her plot or even Zeki. So why did she do that?

In the end I feel one ship has been trolled, but you’d have to take that up with the author.

zero and yuuki have come much closer to each other compared to when she first arrived at cross academy after having left with kaname.

I wouldn’t call them close at the moment. There on different paths really and doing their own thing. They have an alliance of sorts, but compared to how close they used to be, this isn’t close at all if you ask me.

I'm sorry but I rarely see yuuki smiling at kaname and mostly zero.

I’ve seen Yuuki smile around Kaname several times. I don’t mind getting the links to show you if you like. ^^ Though I will add smiles don’t equal love.

I don't really wanna hear that zekis are disrespecting your pairing alot because half the time I come on here looking at a yume's reply it's usually them being rude to a zeki.

You say this yet a lot of you keep bringing it up, so how do you think some of us feel? No sides are angels in this, we’ve all said things we probably shouldn’t. Both sides have had their fair amount of abuse really from the opposite ship. So if you don’t want to hear it, sorry you’re turning a blind eye. I see nearly every week someone talking about my ship being disrespectful to them, so I think I am very much entitled to point out that not all of us are as bad as you paint, and also that we aren’t the only one who have some disrespectful shippers on board. Personally I’m tired of it.

I usually end up commenting after I've seen a yume being disrespectful to what someone may say about zeki or zero.

I’m very much the same, I’ll respond when I feel someone is disrespecting my ship or a character I love. I can get very defensive sometimes, but we all do when it comes to something we care about.

I try laying off on commenting here because I feel I'll be attacked every single time and even if I make a single comment and nothing else.. o_O

I’m sorry you feel this way, but do remember not every Yume has been rude to you, so I feel it’s unfair to take it out on them.

Now I haven’t responded to everything now as it’s late, and was just going to bed when I saw this post. So if you reply you won’t get anything from me until at least 12 hours. Just so you don’t think I am ignoring you. ^^

Firstly Zero. He had a legitimate reason to go and confront Kaname, as Kaname entered the HA without permission, true other things may have been going through his head as well, but as a hunter Zero had a right to go and step in Kaname’s way for coming in.

O really? haha mod war here and now!! everybody get the pop-corn... I am teasing you here...

but i am going to disagree, stop him yes, try to kill him NO-- now how is that combined?

juliet wrote:O really? haha mod war here and now!! everybody get the pop-corn... I am teasing you here...

but i am going to disagree, stop him yes, try to kill him NO-- now how is that combined?

Okay well killing is always excessive, and i dont agree with it, but if we are going to be mad at one of the guys for going in for the kill when the other did the exact same thing, i just see it as a tad unfair towards the other lad. They both had their own reasons for it but is killing really the right thing even if you have been through alot etc? Suppose this is more a moral debate but in vk so much morality gets thrown out the window. Lol!

iiXerxes wrote: Sad thing is, your ship is the one sinking to the bottom. Ever notice how we haven't seen much yume recently not to mention all the zeki moments and how yuuki still trusts zero and is on his side even now? And how she's going against kaname and even tried to kill him? Looks like it's you who's in denial not me :/

Orly?

First of all you’re proving again and again that you don’t even understand/read the post that you’re replying back.

I said that you are in denial cuz you refused to see that your piece of translation was incorrect and not about your preference regarding ships!

We provided 3 sources which were in agreed on the part that Yuuki says to Ruka > “give HIM back to ME” but you stubbornly insisted on>>

iiXerxes wrote: 28:
Yuuki: please, let the gentle person who believes in herself come back.
.
.
Not to mention it makes more sense
.
.
It's most likely right i think. I think that translation of it is the most reliable. I was talking to some vk fans before and one of them could read the chinese scans and thought it was directed towards ruka too.

So let’s see who was in denial in the first place and who wasn’t!

Here the line in question translated from the Japanese text:

行かないといけないから あの人の所に私が = "Because I must go to that person's place."

瑠佳さんの優しさにつけこんでる あの人を私に返してください = "Please return that person who takes advantage of Ruka-san's kindness back to me."

And here what I and many of us supported as correct >>

nina wrote: The line is >> ..."That person who relies on Ruka-san's gentleness, please give him back to me."<< translated from the Chinese raws from another translator fluent to Chinese.

See; I told you that you were hitting a wall there by defending something that in any case was out of context and didn’t make any sense except for you and your friend(s)!

As we supported from the beginning; Yuuki demands from Ruka to return that person (i.e. Kaname) back to HER and not Ruka to come back

Now since you denied the truth so strongly I guess the truth must be really unfavorable and hard for you; i.e. pretty Yumish haha

*********************

And the mods' war will go on sorry Blood but I warned you

Bloodredhead wrote: Firstly Zero. He had a legitimate reason to go and confront Kaname, as Kaname entered the HA without permission, true other things may have been going through his head as well, but as a hunter Zero had a right to go and step in Kaname’s way for coming in.

Blood is this the reason of why Zero had true intention to kill Kaname; cuz he invaded the HA?

This is why he drank Sara’s blood and made a deal with her? Just to remind that he offered his hand to her at the academy i.e. before even Kaname arrives at the HA >>
http://manga.animea.net/vampire-knight-chapter-81-page-5.html

I think this is an excuse that doesn’t reflect even Zero’s reason … it is pretty clear that Zero didn’t attack Kaname cuz of the intrusion but cuz of what he thinks that happened to his family. The other things that you mention are the real reasons for Zero’s attack.

Okay well killing is always excessive, and i dont agree with it, but if we are going to be mad at one of the guys for going in for the kill when the other did the exact same thing, i just see it as a tad unfair towards the other lad.

Sorry Blood but I beg to differ on that too … Kaname didn’t go there to kill Zero. Zero attacked to him with his BR in full power and Kaname tried to defend himself. He also told him to “stop” and “that’s enough Zero” … so with all do respect there is a huge difference there lol.

About Zero’s selfish reasons, sorry but Zero is one of the most unselfish characters there is. Let’s think about this, when he spoke to Kaname his first words when he heard what Kaname said weren’t “why did they do that to me” a line you’d expect of a selfish person really, he goes “why did you get Ichiru involved?” His concern was about his twin brother (who I might add betrayed him for one), not himself. Zero isn’t one to think of himself, in this way him and Kaname are similar. They will throw themselves in with little regard for their own safety or wellbeing. Not a trait you’d expect from some who is selfish.

I’ll answer to this cuz I was who used the word “selfishly” …

Just to make it clear cuz it might have came across wrong … I do not deem Zero as a selfish person overall but I was talking solely for his decision to kill Kaname NOW and protect Sara … right in this moment where too much things are happening far more important and serious from Zero’s drama which happened in the past.

And I’m asking … what and who serves right now Zero’s move?
Does it serve Ichirou?
Does it serve the hunters’ (twisted) interest?
Does it serve Yuuki?
Does it serve the greater good/humans’ safety?

What? Cuz from what I see doesn’t serve none from the above … it serves and satisfies only his need for revenge (cuz Ichirou is dead) hence and Sara’s interests in extension … thus this is a selfish act because it serves only his need ignoring if his decision will inflict disaster …

Does this scene leaves any space for doubts; about Zero’s reasoning to shield Sara and kill Kaname??? >>
http://manga.animea.net/vampire-knight-chapter-81-page-5.html

His last thought >> “Why did that happened to us?” thinking Kaname and giving his hand to Sara!

So where do I have to bank on, in order to give him the benefit of a doubt?

And Zero isn’t the first time that he is putting above all his emotions being indifferent to what might cause his actions > for example the words he said to Yuuki when they parted in the 1st arc.
Sure he is ready to sacrifice himself for the people he love and cherish but right now I do not see that this is the case.

Zero doesn’t know all the facts yet, yeah that’s probably bad of him to act not knowing everything but it’s not Zero’s fault he doesn’t know all of it. He knows what he has been told, so he is working off that, he can’t take action on something he does not know about. His powers don’t reach to mind reading.

No he doesn’t … but what about of what he knows? And he knows quite enough to avert him from siding with Sara even if this is temporarily cuz their interests are identifying right now.
And I will not mention anything else just only one reason … between Sara and Kaname; who is posing a threat for humans? The question is rhetorical ofc. So as a hunter and as the future president of HA which should have been his priority right now; to ensure humans’ safety; OR to pursue his personal vendetta?

It’s more than evident that Sara’s biggest obstacle is Kaname. So by killing Kaname doesn’t serve Sara’s evil plan to dominate the world?

All I’m saying is that his timing is pretty bad and just showing his inability to think based on logic and not based on his emotions.

You also acknowledge the fact that Zero showed his intentions before even hears what Kaname had to say about Shizuka’s case … so my query is; would have had made any difference if Kaname said the truth? Do you believe that Zero would have chosen to believe in Kaname; or in Sara’s words which were giving him the long awaited opportunity to kill Kaname?

I think this scene do not leave much space to doubt about who Zero had already believed >>
http://www.mangareader.net/vampire-knight/78/38
http://www.mangareader.net/vampire-knight/78/39

Nothing in this story is black and white, especially the boys. It’s very much grey this story and its characters.

I second that … but right now Zero has entered the black zone. I was one of the fans who waited to see what Zero had in mind even after he drank from Sara… I thought that he might surprise us but unfortunately for him right now he has become Sara’s ally … for how long; it remains to be seen.

Just to back up my words … a photo for 1000 words >>



It’s Hino who is placing Zero side by side with Sara and not the Yumes cuz we hate him! (I do not mean you Blood )

And to avoid further misunderstandings … I’m talking for the time being and not for Zero’s character in overall or his stance in the future cuz as I said many times, I still believe that he’ll come around sooner or later.

but...if Zero is on Sara's side..why is not yuki on Kaname's side? If she wants to be by his side...she should be in the same square does she? o_O

Suppose this is more a moral debate but in vk so much morality gets thrown out the window. Lol!

Is there morality in VK? where? did i miss it? I am joking...

in a serious mode Zero is ready to kill Kaname but in this occasion Kaname did not attack him, he defends himself, the more Zero pushes it the more he forces kaname to blow him in defense that's understood. Now Zero is acting so drastically not to stop him but to take his revenge, its obvious. Now Kaname since you mention it, yes has indeed committed murders but we do not know his excuses for that, so we have to give him the benefit of the doubt. If Kaname's reasons is only a plan from the past, i will disagree with his actions.

They might be both guilty here but the fact that the one has done whatever has done, does not free the other of his own responsibilities, i think that now its Zero's turn to be under judgement. The unfortunate thing is that his actions are not solely against Kaname but also pro Sara's. It is the latest part that is even more difficult to accept due to the irony of the situation.

msa-x wrote:but...if Zero is on Sara's side..why is not yuki on Kaname's side? If she wants to be by his side...she should be in the same square does she? o_O

i think that side by side has a difference...no one says (i believe if i am wrong correct me) that Yuuki wants kaname to continue with his plan (neither do i to tell you the truth) and this is because he is in danger, risking too much, his reasons are unknown...so it must be revealed sooner or later...

but that does not mean that she does not want to be with him - she rushes to him to stop him so that they can be together- she wants personally to be with him - that's another issue...

msa-x wrote:but...if Zero is on Sara's side..why is not yuki on Kaname's side? If she wants to be by his side...she should be in the same square does she? o_O

The picture just shows the factions that currently divided the story. As we all know, even if Yuuki wanted to be by Kaname's side, she's nowhere near as he left her in Hanabusa's care bringing only Akatsuki and Ruka with him.

maybe it's a premonition of the next chapter jijijijijiji!

In fact..Yuki doesn't deserve Zero.. she didn't recognize him as much as he deserve... if yuki goes to kaname's arms is because Zero deserves more U___U
GO ZERO GO!!

Thanks

Well I really liked your post Bloodredhead Especially this part:

Bloodredhead wrote:
I feel a lot of people are being far too harsh on the opposite guy, and being far too lenient with the guy from their ship. It is understandable as we usually understand our boy better than the other, but so far both boys have done things that they can’t hold their heads up high for. Both have done things wrong, yet both aren’t as bad as some are painting them. We’ve seen both of the boys kinds sides, how they have done good, etc, yet the sufferings they have been through have hardened their hearts to an extent and that’s totally understandable really. Nothing in this story is black and white, especially the boys. It’s very much grey this story and its characters.

Vk exists for long time now and I think its normal everybody sticks to their reading/interpreting habit. But I think if you can look over the limits of your preferred ship, you can see how similar Kaname and Zeros charakters are.


About Sarah:
Maybe she visits Touma and talks him into an alliance? Im wondering why we dont hear anything about other purebloods, arent they alarmed that a PB reaper is going around? Or are they all asleep?

Meleas wrote:Well I really liked your post Bloodredhead Especially this part:

Bloodredhead wrote:
I feel a lot of people are being far too harsh on the opposite guy, and being far too lenient with the guy from their ship. It is understandable as we usually understand our boy better than the other, but so far both boys have done things that they can’t hold their heads up high for. Both have done things wrong, yet both aren’t as bad as some are painting them. We’ve seen both of the boys kinds sides, how they have done good, etc, yet the sufferings they have been through have hardened their hearts to an extent and that’s totally understandable really. Nothing in this story is black and white, especially the boys. It’s very much grey this story and its characters.

Vk exists for long time now and I think its normal everybody sticks to their reading/interpreting habit. But I think if you can look over the limits of your preferred ship, you can see how similar Kaname and Zeros charakters are.

Thanks.

The boys although different in many ways are also quite similar in others. Even Yuuki commented on it before when she was seeing Kaname's memories, how kaname reminded her of how Zero looked, and that it was similar.

About Sarah:
Maybe she visits Touma and talks him into an alliance? Im wondering why we dont hear anything about other purebloods, arent they alarmed that a PB reaper is going around? Or are they all asleep?

Hmm....with touma its either an alliance she wants or she may want to devour him and power up. I think we will get a clearer picture of what she is up to in the HA within the next two chapters. I feel alot of next chapter will be centered around Ruka being hurt so we might not get alot on Sara till the chapter after.

With the other purebloods they could very well be asleep so don't know what is happening or they might be hiding or something? Not really sure. Not sure how many pb's are left anymore. Hopefully hino may show something.

@Nina: Still writing my reply to you, so once its done i'll post it. Sorry for making you wait, but i was busy making some graphic stuff.

Bloodredhead wrote: @Nina: Still writing my reply to you, so once its done i'll post it. Sorry for making you wait, but i was busy making some graphic stuff.

It’s fine. It’s fine Blood
The graphic stuff comes first … I wanna see


Now about the “fronts” and who is with whom etc…

I think we confuse some things here. Who is with whom; side by side currently doesn’t necessarily reflects and the feelings for each other; neither who isn’t as well.

The most apparent example for what I’m saying is Zero:
He is placed by Sara’s side and this moment are sharing the same interest > killing Kaname but this doesn’t mean ofc that Zero suddenly loved Sara or that he doesn’t hate PBs anymore! Or that IF they could achieve their goal to kill Kaname that they would remain on the same side afterwards. It’s like the enemy of my biggest enemy is my “friend” at this moment.

Personally I’m not mad with Zero cuz he wants Kaname dead! From what he believes as true this is understandable.
And this isn’t something new to begin with and I think we all expected a clash between them…
My opposition stems from his timing and the means that he used to achieve that mainly cuz this led to serve/accommodate Sara’s interests.

About Yuuki: The fact that she says I want to go where Kaname is or that she wants to “take” Ruka’s place (for me at least) doesn’t mean that she wants to help Kaname with his plan i.e. forming a front together! I mean she won’t grab her Artemis and say “Ok Kaname whose turn is next; let’s go chop some butts” hahaha

Yuuki has said several times that she wants to stop Kaname together with her love feelings for him i.e. her actions and her feelings aren’t controversial and as I see it this is for two reasons:

1. Cuz she disagree with what he says that is his goal > to annihilate the PBs, and certainly there are things that she doesn’t know yet.
However Yuuki had revealed her thoughts in a random time when she had visited Isaya as reaper >>

Yuuki: I am talking about someone’s life right now. Shearing away someone’s life… I told Zero to live … with this same tongue. I was sad Kaname had crushed the lives of many… and wanted to stop him from doing it again … with this same heart. I thought about what I, one small existence, could do. I thought and I thought… (volume 12, chapter 58)

So what Yuuki says right now, that she wants to stop Kaname isn’t new either but this doesn’t reflect the feelings that she still has for Kaname (as her recent statements have confirm many times) which brings me to the second reason.

2. Kaname has abandoned her and he is pushing her away in every way and every chance he has, demonstrating as a reason his goal/plan and that he is a mad man, but Yuuki knows better >>
Yuuki: I think I understand now … If I trace the roots I’m definitely part of it… For this reason I must stop Kaname

On the other hand Yuuki cannot accept that … she loves him and she wants him back … she wants to live with him as they promised. Thus; seeing that Kaname’s current path is driving them apart and probably sensing that this path is a self-destructive one; naturally wants to stop him.

I see some fans to downgrade Yuuki cuz she hasn’t give up Kaname running to Zero’s arms reckoned that she is “crazy”, worthless or blind from her maddening love.
For me this is far from the truth and actually is quite the opposite. Is because Yuuki knows Kaname better than anyone else and she can “see” the façade he’s putting on which on a second layer proves that Yuuki understands him.

If you look Kaname through Zero’s eyes sure you will see no reason of why Yuuki still love Kaname and will deem her as blind and worthless but the story has offer much more clues and perspectives than Zero’s

Yuuki and Kaname are sharing the same ideal for co-existence but they have different views of how they could achieve that. Is like Kaname said to her The world you see is different from what I see…

In short Yuuki has strike her own path even if this means that she has to go against Kaname and stop him, something that Kaname knew from the very beginning anyway. And this is actually very good cuz first of all shows Yuuki’s maturation and by walking on her own path will make Yuuki shine; justifying and boosting her role as the main heroine in this story. (Btw on a side note … now I see more the importance of Hanabusa on Yuuki’s side i.e. why Kaname had to stage that show with Aido-dono in front of their eyes lol)

To bring another example > Ruka: We saw her to throwing herself in this battle and seemingly protecting Zero. Viz she interfered/stopped Kaname … does this mean that she changed sides and will cope with Zero? I don’t think so. On a second readout she protected Kaname, Yuuki who was present in that scene and if Ruka hadn’t stepped in Yuuki would have done this I guess, i.e. and in extension Yume.

Another example: Yuuki said to Zero to protect Sara for now. Does this mean that she is on Sara’s side? Definitely not, as it doesn’t mean as well that her reasons to “protect” Sara at that moment had the same motive as Zero’s which as we saw was to kill Kaname.

Therefore what I’m trying to say here is that we have to distinguish the motive from the act itself and the feelings from the “fronts”/groups/sides that have formed for the time being.

In this light even if Yuuki will know that Zero drank from Sara and tried to kill Kaname won’t change her feelings for him … sure she might be sad and maybe if she could have stopped that she probably would (for both boys sake), but this doesn’t also mean that she would hate Zero or that she would “erase” him from her heart and the same goes for Kaname too.

This is Yuuki, a gentle and forgiving being thus I beg to differ with beliefs or expectations that Yuuki shall or must change her feelings from one chapter to another. She won’t … neither for Zero and nor for Kaname. And bottom line she shouldn’t cuz neither from the boys is as appeared currently to be … Zero is deceived from Sara who exploits his emotions and his need for revenge and Kaname cuz he is wearing a mask on.

So Yuuki as the girl who knows better both of them cannot base her feelings to a factitious icon cuz this is what would degrade her and not the other way around.


CHAPTER 82 HAS BEEN SCANLATED!

HERE >> http://manga.animea.net/vampire-knight-chapter-82.html